Sixers get Brand... Now What?

[DuckyNinja]

how many people shoot 40% from the three for a full season and are taking enough attempts for that 40% to matter?

Thank you for making my point for me.

I get what you're saying about how many shoot the 40% (31 is the count last season) but jem's question about attempts is somewhat legit. Either way... Gordon, Richardson, and Hamilton all shot above the almighty 40% mark. I'm just hoping that Iguodala improves on that 32% mark that he had last year. It's possible that with a little more spacing that he can get that number up but how high is the real question.

I don't see any way we can reasonably get Gordon with Iguodala unless Deng gets stolen, but he would be the only option that I think is a legitimate 3 point shooter.  Richardson is a career 36.3% 3 point shooter who has had 2 seasons over 37%.  Hamilton is a career 34.3% 3 point shooter who's had 2 really good years and a bunch of horrible ones and has never averaged even 1 3pg.  I understand wanting a 3 point shooter.  You just haven't given a starting quality option who would provide a consistent 3 point threat that we would have a chance of getting with Iggy.  Richardson would be a decent option, but it doesn't seem like a big enough upgrade to warrant giving away a star defender who can put up points and shoot 33-35% from 3.  Lou Will can basically give the same 3 point shooting Richardson would.

[jemagee]

If the only addition to the roster of significance this off season is Elton Brand (minus draft pick speights), I'm going to call it a good off season, a great off season makes the sixers final contenders next year (and i don't believe they are now, i mean seriously, with the celtics they are right now at best the #4 seed minus the vagaries of a better record than a division winner)...and it would entitle quite a few upgrades at other spots (and sam dalembert vastly improving his game instead of playing for canada and losing in the olympics)

[TheGuiltyParty]

I don't see any way we can reasonably get Gordon with Iguodala unless Deng gets stolen, but he would be the only option that I think is a legitimate 3 point shooter.  Richardson is a career 36.3% 3 point shooter who has had 2 seasons over 37%.  Hamilton is a career 34.3% 3 point shooter who's had 2 really good years and a bunch of horrible ones and has never averaged even 1 3pg.  I understand wanting a 3 point shooter.  You just haven't given a starting quality option who would provide a consistent 3 point threat that we would have a chance of getting with Iggy.  Richardson would be a decent option, but it doesn't seem like a big enough upgrade to warrant giving away a star defender who can put up points and shoot 33-35% from 3.  Lou Will can basically give the same 3 point shooting Richardson would.

Out of curiosity, are you saying that you don't believe the Bulls would trade Gordon for Iguodala for financial reasons or because you don't believe the Bulls would play Iguodala at the 2?

[shadowTerp]

Second best news: GS got Magette, so they can't throw ridiculous $$$ at Igoudala.  

[TheGuiltyParty]

Do the Clippers try to go after Iguodala with their space and try to place Thornton at the 4?? I think Smith might get an offer from LAC.

[carolina blue]

IMO, signing Brand makes it a great offseason.  Lots to like about this move:

>>  You add the best player available, who happens to play your position of greatest need.

>>  Brand is an established star, a 1A player who slides your younger guys into roles that they are more prepared to play.

>>  Team dynamics - it could have been trouble to pay Smith more than you offer Iguodala, being that he has not established himself as a superior player.  It will be far easier for Andre to accept Brand as the team's highest paid player than Josh Smith.

>>  Adding a guy who's older (yet not old) gives you some stability/leadership


Stefanksi had a plan, he became a prime player in the FA Market and took advantage of the Clippers being the Clippers and swooped in when they pissed off their star PF.

I don't think that they need to bend over backwards to get a shooter right now.  I'll be fine seeing how the young guys develop in that aspect and waiting until during the season lets you see how everything meshes and what your true needs will be.  I think that Iguodala is much better as a catch and shoot guy whether that be from a kick-out or from a play started as a pick-and-roll.  I think that Young has the potential to develop in this regard as well.  Neither is very good off the dribble, but I've seen some positive things when they have their feet set.

For those hell-bent on adding a shooter this summer, my list would include:

Rashad McCants  MIN
Shawne Williams  IND
JJ Redick  ORL

Guys that are  on their rookie deals, who aren't locks to be extended by their current teams.

Otherwise, you're in prime position to add a shooter with the MLE next off-season.

[DuckyNinja]

I don't see any way we can reasonably get Gordon with Iguodala unless Deng gets stolen, but he would be the only option that I think is a legitimate 3 point shooter.  Richardson is a career 36.3% 3 point shooter who has had 2 seasons over 37%.  Hamilton is a career 34.3% 3 point shooter who's had 2 really good years and a bunch of horrible ones and has never averaged even 1 3pg.  I understand wanting a 3 point shooter.  You just haven't given a starting quality option who would provide a consistent 3 point threat that we would have a chance of getting with Iggy.  Richardson would be a decent option, but it doesn't seem like a big enough upgrade to warrant giving away a star defender who can put up points and shoot 33-35% from 3.  Lou Will can basically give the same 3 point shooting Richardson would.

Out of curiosity, are you saying that you don't believe the Bulls would trade Gordon for Iguodala for financial reasons or because you don't believe the Bulls would play Iguodala at the 2?

The Bulls already have a logjam with Rose, Hinrich, Hughes, and Sefolosha, and they have Deng at SF.  What does getting another SG/SF do for them?  If they lose Deng, that obviously changes quickly.

Here's a list of guys who are potentially available, averaged more than 15 ppg last season, and have consistently hit the 3 ball at a 38% or higher clip: Gordon, Barbosa, Terry, Mike Miller, and I guess Chauncey Billups, but I don't see why they would trade Billups to a team that just became an actual threat to them for any kind of reasonable deal.  Are any of those guys players you'd rather see starting at SG than Iggy?  Gordon, Barbosa, and Terry are all undersized and wouldn't be able to guard any of the big SGs.  Miller's actually an okay option, but wouldn't be able to be traded until the last week in August, and I'm not sure what else they could add that would really entice us.  I guess Rashad McCants as another 3-baller in a rotation with Thad and Miller.  That's about the only option I see that wouldn't be just massively downgrading in defense to get a 3 point shooter.  And I made the cut off 38% because Lou Williams is a 36% shooter and that's around league average.

[Derek Bodner]

Second best news: GS got Magette, so they can't throw ridiculous $$$ at Igoudala.   

But now the clips can.

[TheGuiltyParty]

Here's a list of guys who are potentially available, averaged more than 15 ppg last season, and have consistently hit the 3 ball at a 38% or higher clip: Gordon, Barbosa, Terry, Mike Miller, and I guess Chauncey Billups,

Barbosa is out there and could be had... but not for Iguodala. The same applies for Terry and Miller while Billups isn't going to get moved to us for multiple reasons. The only name on that list that I would move Iguodala for is Gordon but you're right... they already have a logjam and so such a move makes little sense unless they do make the rumored trade of Harrington for Hinrich. If that goes through, then I think it could make sense.

[DuckyNinja]

Here's a list of guys who are potentially available, averaged more than 15 ppg last season, and have consistently hit the 3 ball at a 38% or higher clip: Gordon, Barbosa, Terry, Mike Miller, and I guess Chauncey Billups,

Barbosa is out there and could be had... but not for Iguodala. The same applies for Terry and Miller while Billups isn't going to get moved to us for multiple reasons. The only name on that list that I would move Iguodala for is Gordon but you're right... they already have a logjam and so such a move makes little sense unless they do make the rumored trade of Harrington for Hinrich. If that goes through, then I think it could make sense.

They would still have Hughes and Sefolosha.  The only way it makes sense is if somebody manages to steal Deng.  But I really don't see that happening.  So please, while I enjoy telling you that the stats show you're wrong, cool it with the "get RIP or Redd because they're great 3 point shooters" please.  It's factually inaccurate.

[TheGuiltyParty]

They would still have Hughes and Sefolosha.  The only way it makes sense is if somebody manages to steal Deng.  But I really don't see that happening.  So please, while I enjoy telling you that the stats show you're wrong, cool it with the "get RIP or Redd because they're great 3 point shooters" please.  It's factually inaccurate.

Wait... did I say they are great 3 point shooters? You're a fun guy to chat with... 19 right??

[Derek Bodner]

So please, while I enjoy telling you that the stats show you're wrong, cool it with the "get RIP or Redd because they're great 3 point shooters" please.  It's factually inaccurate.

Redd's a career 38.8% 3 pt shooter, making 1.8 per game.

RIP's never been a 3 pt shooter, but he's been a great shooter for years now.  He's also improved his 3 pt game tremendously over the last 3 years.  Showing his career stats that include his rookie year in 1999 really isn't relevant to the topic at hand.

[Mozy-76er Fan]

but for all of the good Iguodala has done, he came up extremely short when it mattered and I don't believe anyone is convinced he's an actual 2 guard. As for getting someone who can shoot 40% and up from 3, that's fine. I hear that Ben Gordon guy is available and yes, he's a better fit at the 2 than Andre Iguodala is for this team at this point.

1st off - I think you and others are putting WAY TOO MUCH emphasis on that one series against Prince.  Iggy is young and smart.  He will learn and grow from that experience it doesn't define him. 

I think Iggy was a lot more valuable than Gordon.  Gordon is too one dimensional and Iggy does everything else better than Gordon except outside shooting.  If we trade for Gordon and give them Iggy we would have to get a more in return. 

[DuckyNinja]

TGP: You've been saying we need 3 point shooters, then naming those guys.  I don't think it's unfair to make the leap that you want those guys because they are 3 point shooters.  But if they're not great 3 point shooters, why do you want them?  That's a serious question.

DBods: I'm sorry, but telling me to look at all of Redd's career than not at all of RIP's career is just a classic case of stat twisting.  Take out Redd's first 3 years (so you're just looking at his last 5 years) and the average is something in the 36% range.  Those 2 early seasons of 43%+ just inflate his career.  RIP's had 2 ridiculous seasons and 2 bad seasons in the past 4, and still hasn't made more than 1 pg in his career.  That doesn't scream "good 3 point shooter" to me.

[TheGuiltyParty]

1st off - I think you and others are putting WAY TOO MUCH emphasis on that one series against Prince.  Iggy is young and smart.  He will learn and grow from that experience it doesn't define him. 

I think Iggy was a lot more valuable than Gordon.  Gordon is too one dimensional and Iggy does everything else better than Gordon except outside shooting.  If we trade for Gordon and give them Iggy we would have to get a more in return. 
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I don't doubt Iguodala's intelligence... I just doubt him to be a reliable 2 guard on a team that competes for a title which won't be this year. I hope he does learn from his experience in the playoffs and only gets better but that was obviously a rough start (I'm sure Prince has a LOT to do with it).

As for Gordon's value, I agree... if we actually did something like that... I would probably ask for something more to but as said in many ways, a deal of that sort is extremely unlikely.