Mr. Smith visits Philly...

[tk76-]

Smith is more icing, Iguodala glue.

Neither will make you a contender, but both are ghood peices to have.  Neither would have the type of an impact as Brand, let alone a true franchise altering star like Kobe, Duncan or Lebron.

We are mostly talking about building the next step, and are far from being contencers.

[anklebreaker]

Well, I guess Smith is going to be in Philly tomorrow.  Hopefully we'll get a feel on where this could go. 

[TheGuiltyParty]

I don't get what this meeting tomorrow is really going to be about. I mean... Smith is going to fly up here and we're going to say "Do you like money??". Smith might say he likes it here and could himself fitting in and blah, blah, blah but the fact of the matter is that getting Smith to want to sign here is an extremely small piece of the puzzle.

Signing him is going to come down to whether we can structure a contract that will scare off Atlanta's ownership or not. I have my doubts that we can so I really do believe that we need to spend as much time working on Plan C as we seem to have been on Plan A.

[anklebreaker]

They said Childress is visiting here as well this week.  I like Chill, but we don't need him. 

[bebopdeluxe]

As an employer, if you are about to give a 22-year-old kid $60+ million (with perhaps a front-loaded $15-20 mil), you have him come in and "kiss the ring" (I'm sure that Ed Snider would like to see that).

 

I really do have mixed feelings about Smith - I have seen stats that suggest that he actually is a pretty productive PF...but he certainly has the potential to fall in love with his jumper, and he's not the kind of guy who you can run your half-court offense through near the lane in the guts of the game (and neither is our center).  If we sign him, and keep Iggy, our two highest-salary guys are going to be playing positions that are not exactly in perfect lock-step with their respective offensive tool-boxes.  

I guess that - in the post-Iverson era - I would love to see us roll players out there who fit their positions...we seem to have too many guys (Iggy, LouW, JSmith if we sign him) who we are still trying to "make" into these players (make Iggy a SG...make Lou a PG)...perhaps the reason why I appreciate Miller so much is because he IS a PG.

As Conlin would say..."If I were King of the World..."

1) Trade Miller and Carney for 'Sheed;
2) Renounce Iggy;
3) Hit Ellis with an offer sheet (I know...less likely with Davis going to LAC);
4) Trade cap room and pick/picks for Hinrich;

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Hinrich
Ellis
Thad
'Sheed
Sammy

Five guys - all playing their natural positions.

I know it's not going to happen, but I guess I'm getting tired of trying to pound square pegs in round holes...I fear that we are doing that with Iggy at SG, and I worry still about JSmith at PF.

[TheGuiltyParty]

That's a massive overhaul. I really do like the idea of using the cap space to get a PG instead of a PF and using Miller and filler (hey, that rhymes!) to land us a decent PF. I've said that I was for acquiring Hinrich and Marion but I think I would be for a lot of combos involving Hinrich.

I think this team has multiple holes and is about to have Iguodala playing out of position. Getting a PF doesn't fix this team or in most cases even make it THAT much better than it was this year. That's why I'm all for exploring other options (trading Miller, trading Iguodala) to improve this squad so that it can mature into a contender.

Does a team of Miller/Iguodala/Thad/Smith/Dalembert make you anything more than a 5 seed in the East? Will that starting 5 be together for the next 3 or 4 years? I doubt both that's why I'd look to move Miller as well.

[bebopdeluxe]

TGP:

I have the same questions that I had last summer (and $57 million dollars ago)...can Andre Iguodala become a better-than-average SG?

I don't know.

His handle in the half-court certainly isn't there.  For the most part, his jumper isn't, either.  I think it's pretty telling when you hear Stefanski say that he would consider LouW for more SG minutes - he currently is probably our best option there - especially on offense.  I'm not advocating AI-redux with Lou, but I have concerns - serious concerns - about committing $55 mil to Iggy as our SG of the future.

(and I'm really bummed that Ellis is probably completely unavailable with Davis gone and Gil going back to WAS)

[TheGuiltyParty]

Seriously..... doesn't it make WAY more sense to use Iguodala as a trade piece than it does to give him a boatload of cash? Signing him means that you have the worst shooting backcourt outside of 16 feet in NBA history. He's a really nice player and does a lot of really nice things... but he's not a shooting guard. I think he's got a fairly decent value on the market and I think a lot of teams would look into a sign-and-trade for him. Also, because we're under the cap, the BYC issues wouldn't come into play which means we could get fair value for him right now.

I'm not sure what he could fetch but I sure as hell would see what PFs Iguodala could fetch us. If you could get a fairly solid PF for him, I would do it and then use only $8MIL of our cap space for someone like Maggette.

[Skates]

As Conlin would say..."If I were King of the World..."

1) Trade Miller and Carney for 'Sheed;
2) Renounce Iggy;
3) Hit Ellis with an offer sheet (I know...less likely with Davis going to LAC);
4) Trade cap room and pick/picks for Hinrich;

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Hinrich
Ellis
Thad
'Sheed
Sammy

Five guys - all playing their natural positions.

I know it's not going to happen, but I guess I'm getting tired of trying to pound square pegs in round holes...I fear that we are doing that with Iggy at SG, and I worry still about JSmith at PF.

Funny thing,  GS is considering moving Ellis to PG, because they have a need and he has no hope of ever adequately playing D against NBA level 2 gaurds (luckily in GS defense is an afterthought most of the time).  Chicago is thinking of moving Hinrich to Sg because he shoots way better than he passes and can't really defend quicker PGs.  Thad has not yet shown he is ready to play SF, although I agree that it is his best position down the road.  Sheed has been esssentially playing C for several years now, not PF, although he could probably switch back, he's not getting any younger or quicker.  Sammy is still pretty skinny and against any sizable center he would guard the PF and Sheed would guard the C in your line-up.  Not exactly a bunch of guys prototypical for the stereotype of their positions.

Iggy has played SG for several years here in Philly and is a nice, proven complement to a scoring/shooting PG and Miller is here on borrowed time.  Josh Smith has been playing PF for several years in Atlanta and is not really undersized for the way the position is evolving these days (he is a copule of inches taller and 25-30 pounds heavier than Darrell Arthur whom everyone seemed to love as a four, plus has superior athleticism, a long wingspan and great jumping ability). 

[The Poster]

Yahoo is reporting that Easy Ed will present Smith with a contract tomorrow...ooohh and ahhhhh


http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AqxAA_3sDzEXBjz7rGrzXn85nYcB?slug=aw-spursmaggette070108&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

[bebopdeluxe]

Skates:

To be fair...

1) If GS is considering moving Ellis to PG, it is because of the loss of Davis and no other option is jumping out at them right now that would be better...this does not mean that Ellis' best position (offensively at least) is as SG;
2) Hinrich is being considered at SG because they have a new PG, their SG may not get resigned (or may get signed away) and they are paying him $10 mil to do SOMETHING;
3) We agree on Thad;
4) 'Sheed is listed as a PF...and my exercise is looking at where these guys would play on offense...I have no question in certain situations, 'Sheed would guard the 5 and Sammy the 4, but on this team, 'Sheed's skill set would clearly be at the PF on offense...right?

The starting SG on this team last season was Willie Green.  It is my opinion that - while Iggy has played significant minutes at SG during his tenure with the Sixers, he has done it (IMO) in spite of his less-than-adequate handle in the halfcourt, his inability to break down decent defenders off the bounce, and his inconsistent jumper (which, again, he cannot creat with the dribble).  Just because Iggy has played SG for a while in Philly does not mean that he is a good SG - at least, on the offensive end in the half-court set (which is what they will need from him if this team is going anywhere in May and June...much less April.

[DuckyNinja]

I just hafta say, the opinion of Sixers fans about Iguodala and the opinion of just about everybody else is about as opposite as it gets.  While we're all down on him, most other fans think he's quite a player.  I did some straight statistical research the other day comparing Iggy to Carmelo, and really, the stats say that Melo is only a smidge better than Iggy.  And that includes the playoffs.  So at least statistically, if you think Melo would be a good enough scorer to be a 2 guard for us, there's no reason not to like Iggy just the same.  And lemme reiterate: it was just statistically and just for offensive numbers.

That being said, Iggy really is a good scorer, even if he does do it a little more quietly and differently than we'd like.  Really, we managed to score plenty of points last year without a real 3 point threat.  And while he was shut down in the playoffs, it's pretty tough to score when you not only have one of the best defenders in the entire league draped on you, but everybody coming to play help defense the moment you start doing anything.  We made the playoffs and went to 6 games with the Pistons while starting WILLIE GREEN at the two and a 6'8 215 lb 19 year old rookie and a total bench player with not an offensive bone in his body at the four.  We may not be able to shoot the three, but I'm pretty sure dunks, shots in the paint, and free throws are higher percentage shots anyway.  We led the league in points in the paint or something like that last year.  A lineup of Miller-Iggy-Thad-Smith-Dalembert would be highly efficient on the offensive end, both in FG% and in OREB.  We don't need the 3 pointer to stretch out the defense when a simple mid-range jumper would be enough to get them away from the paint.

[jemagee]

That all depends what stats you want to look at and how you want to compare the players, anthony is over rated proabably because he won an ncaa tournament as a freshman and was in the lebron draft so was anointed.

I think another problem is that sixer fans don't know what a '10 million dollar a year' player is - if sam dalembert is worth the contract he got than so is andre iguodala...

[DuckyNinja]

That all depends what stats you want to look at and how you want to compare the players, anthony is over rated proabably because he won an ncaa tournament as a freshman and was in the lebron draft so was anointed.

I think another problem is that sixer fans don't know what a '10 million dollar a year' player is - if sam dalembert is worth the contract he got than so is andre iguodala...

The stats I looked at most was FG%, 3%, FTA, PPS, and PPG/ShPG.  The only one Melo had a clear advantage in was 3%.  And I think the bigger problem is that Iggy is suffering from Next Guy syndrome.  He was anointed as the guy who was replacing Iverson.  He's not Iverson.  Fans can't handle that.  A perfect example: you don't want to be the QB following Favre.  You want to be the QB following the QB following Favre, because that guy sucked because he wasn't Favre and you're not the guy who sucked.  Iguodala has actually done a great job handling the pressure of being "the guy" following the Answer, even if the Sixers really don't get put under the microscope as much by the media.

[tk76-]

You know I agree 100%, but am getting a bit tired of banging my head against the wall.  Iguodala can be good and a 10M player without being either a superstar or a bum- but people like to go to extremes (I'm channeling Billy Joel, but its a lousy effort on his part...)

I can understand wondering about how Iguodala will fit at SG with his specific talents versus the team's/his limitations.  I don't understand the notion that he should be thrown under the bus for trying to get a top 60 NBA contract.