Author Topic: Where Artest will end up  (Read 5900 times)

Offline Skandery

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1710
    • MSN Messenger - skandery27@hotmail.com
    • View Profile
    • Email
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #15 on: December 15, 2005, 11:46:58 AM »
westkoast,

Being in the West coast (I made a funny), you might not be privy to all the goings on of a lowly EC expansion team like the Charlotte Bobcats and its players.  Gerald Wallace has established himself as a premier wing defender in the league.  Now his limited Sportcenter/TNT exposure and the fact that Bernie Bickerstaff runs a deep rotation has made it hard for Wallace to nab some personal notoriety.  Something that counts when selections are being made for all-defensive teams.  But here are some comparative stats to chew on:

Gerald Wallace:

33.1 -- MPG
3.6   -- D-RPG
1.3   -- BPG        (29th in NBA)
2.1   -- SPG        (6th   in NBA)

Ron Artest:

37.7 -- MPG
3.3   -- D-RPG
0.7   -- BPG       (71st in NBA)
2.6   -- SPG       (1st in NBA)


   
"But guys like us, we don't pay attention to the polls. We know that polls are just a collection of statistics that reflect what people are thinking in 'reality'. And reality has a well-known liberal bias."

Offline Joe Vancil

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2208
    • ICQ Messenger - 236778608
    • MSN Messenger - joev5638@hotmail.com
    • AOL Instant Messenger - GenghisThePBear
    • Yahoo Instant Messenger - joev5638
    • View Profile
    • http://www.joev.com
    • Email
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #16 on: December 15, 2005, 11:52:03 AM »
Oops.  

It's "if Larry Bird WASN'T white, he'd be just another player."

As for Polar Bears and penguins - HOW DOES EVERYONE KEEP COMING UP WITH THIS?  Penguins are from the ANTARCTIC.  Polar Bears are from the ARCTIC.
 
Joe

-----------
Support your right to keep and arm bears!
Club (baby) seals, not sandwiches!

Offline westkoast

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8624
    • View Profile
    • Email
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #17 on: December 15, 2005, 11:57:42 AM »
Quote
westkoast,

Being in the West coast (I made a funny), you might not be privy to all the goings on of a lowly EC expansion team like the Charlotte Bobcats and its players.  Gerald Wallace has established himself as a premier wing defender in the league.  Now his limited Sportcenter/TNT exposure and the fact that Bernie Bickerstaff runs a deep rotation has made it hard for Wallace to nab some personal notoriety.  Something that counts when selections are being made for all-defensive teams.  But here are some comparative stats to chew on:

Gerald Wallace:

33.1 -- MPG
3.6   -- D-RPG
1.3   -- BPG        (29th in NBA)
2.1   -- SPG        (6th   in NBA)

Ron Artest:

37.7 -- MPG
3.3   -- D-RPG
0.7   -- BPG       (71st in NBA)
2.6   -- SPG       (1st in NBA)
Skandery I think you forget that Gerald Wallace suited up for the Sacremento Kings who at the time I followed  being that they were a team I liked and dislike (due to the rivalary) at the same time.  He was a defensive player there too.

They get the same amount of rebounds but as far as altering shots, getting in players heads, physical play...those dont show up in stat sheets.  Those are all things Ron Artest does very well.  Plus he is alot more intimidating than Wallace.  I wouldn't underestimate that.  If the offensive player is ever worried for a minute if he does anything to Artest he made get socked up like a fan then Artest wins by getting the player to take his mind off the game plan.
http://I-Really-Shouldn't-Put-A-Link-To-A-Blog-I-Dont-Even-Update.com

Offline Ted

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1468
    • AOL Instant Messenger - Rustedhart
    • Yahoo Instant Messenger - ruteha
    • View Profile
    • Email
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #18 on: December 15, 2005, 12:27:14 PM »
Quote
When he left Detroit, he moved off of the small forward position and into the power forward position.  From that point on, his defense was never really that good again.
Tell that to Karl Malone and the Jazz.
"You take him Perk!" ~Kevin Garnett

"I think the responsibility the Democrats have may rest more in resisting any efforts by Republicans in the Congress or by me when I was President to put some standards in and tighten up a little bit on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac." ~Bill Clinton

Offline WayOutWest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7411
    • View Profile
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2005, 01:05:10 PM »
Quote
Quote
When he left Detroit, he moved off of the small forward position and into the power forward position.  From that point on, his defense was never really that good again.
Tell that to Karl Malone and the Jazz.
Don't ask James Worthy or Magic about Rodman as a defender either cause they'd be like "who?".  As an SF he was decent and just becomming a premier defender, as a PF is where he made his mark.
"History shouldn't be a mystery"
"Our story is real history"
"Not his story"

"My people's culture was strong, it was pure"
"And if not for that white greed"
"It would've endured"

"Laker hate causes blindness"

Offline JoMal

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3361
    • View Profile
    • http://
    • Email
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #20 on: December 15, 2005, 01:24:13 PM »
Quote
Oops.  

It's "if Larry Bird WASN'T white, he'd be just another player."

As for Polar Bears and penguins - HOW DOES EVERYONE KEEP COMING UP WITH THIS?  Penguins are from the ANTARCTIC.  Polar Bears are from the ARCTIC.
So!

Do you think a polar bear, such as yourself, would NOT be interested in pursuing a tasty penquin, if one should happen to be lost in the north pole?
"We must not confuse dissent with disloyalty.....We will not be driven by fear into an age of unreason.....We are not descended from fearful men, not from men who feared to write, to speak, to associate and to defend causes that were for the moment unpopular....We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home."

Offline westkoast

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8624
    • View Profile
    • Email
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #21 on: December 15, 2005, 01:48:15 PM »
Quote
Oops.  

It's "if Larry Bird WASN'T white, he'd be just another player."

As for Polar Bears and penguins - HOW DOES EVERYONE KEEP COMING UP WITH THIS?  Penguins are from the ANTARCTIC.  Polar Bears are from the ARCTIC.
Actually they are from Pittsburg.........


 :bash:



Someone at break this morning said they just straight cut Artest today??!?!?!  This cant be true.
http://I-Really-Shouldn't-Put-A-Link-To-A-Blog-I-Dont-Even-Update.com

Guest_Randy

  • Guest
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #22 on: December 15, 2005, 02:24:06 PM »
Okay, from a Fantasy Owner who has Al Harrington -- Hawks DON'T pull this trade!!!


I'm sure just about EVERY team would like a shot at the Artest lotto -- however, who has someone that Indy wants and needs to trade for him?  

Indy CAN do just fine without Artest -- they can move Jackson to SF and while I like Jackson at SG better, he can play SF.  They also have some young players who can step up -- but they would be BETTER off with a decent SF.  One that can play some defense and shoot the ball from outside.  

I found JO's comments about Peja quite interesting about the EC having everything "packed" in more.  O'Neal seemed to be intimating that he didn't have as much room to move around because the defense plays tighter -- hey, they can't play tighter in the key and be tight on the perimeter as well.  Peja is one of those guys who can sit on the outside and wait for someone to throw him to ball to shoot.  That fits Peja JUST fine!  He doesn't have to have the ball in his hands to go up for a shot (that's Artest).  

As for Al Harrington -- I would think they would want a shooter rather than a scorer.  Besides, I don't want Harrington to move -- I'm afraid that it will hurt what he is doing for me!   :rolleyes:  

Guest_Randy

  • Guest
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #23 on: December 15, 2005, 02:29:06 PM »
Oh yeah, one more thing:

Now the LAKERS are reported as wanting Artest?  PLEASE say it's not so!!!  Haven't the Lakers learned ANYTHING from the signings of Rodman, Rider, Brown, etc?  

Besides, who would we trade for him?  I hear George and Bynum?  Well, I'd LOVE to see us get rid of George but I DON'T want to see the Lakers sign Artest.  Now if we could get rid of Brown by trading for Artest?  I'd be VERY happy doing that -- mainly because I STILL detest that move!  

I don't see Artest being very happy on ANY team that he isn't "the man" -- and frankly, I can't think of a team that could or would make him "the man."  Boston might be the closest (if they traded Pierce for him) but why would they trade Pierce?  

Charlotte would be the logical choice (i.e. being "the man) and they could promise some pretty good first round draft picks in addition to a Gerald Wallace.  

However, if they could throw in a big -- I think that Indy could really use Brevin Knight!

Offline westkoast

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8624
    • View Profile
    • Email
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2005, 04:59:06 PM »
MEMPHIS, Tenn. - The Lakers - and coach Phil Jackson, in particular - have strong interest in acquiring troubled Indiana Pacers forward Ron Artest, a source close to the team said Wednesday.
But the Lakers are not willing to part with forward Lamar Odom in a trade package and are uncertain whether they even will be among the league's leading contenders to land Artest, who demanded a trade over the weekend.

The Lakers have come together recently - winning five of six games on a long road trip that ended with a 94-79 victory at Memphis Wednesday - but Jackson is said to believe the team could advance deep in the Western Conference playoffs with Artest.

Although Artest was suspended 73 games last season for his part in the NBA's most infamous brawl, Jackson spoke in positive terms about the 26-year-old forward - a former All-Star and defensive player of the year - before Monday's game in Dallas.

"I don't see how you're going to get value out of this player who in my estimation is one of the most valuable players in the league," Jackson said. "Of course, I estimate him perhaps higher than other people. But I think he's a terrific player. He adds a big dimension to every game he plays in."

Lakers general manager Mitch Kupchak would not comment Wednesday on any player under contract to another team or address trade rumors. He added that Jackson probably would speak similarly about 15 to 20 other players across the league.

The Lakers are not even sure the Pacers ultimately will decide to trade Artest, though Indiana CEO Donnie Walsh said Monday the team would try. The problem comes in getting comparable players for Artest, who will make $6.8 million this season.

Most NBA stars are paid nearly double what Artest is making and the league's salary-cap rules require teams to approximately match player salaries in a trade.

In a Saturday interview with the Indianapolis Star, Artest said in a "perfect world" he would go home and play for the New York Knicks. Isiah Thomas, the Knicks' president of basketball operations, is believed to have coveted Artest for some time.

Speaking before New York's game Wednesday against the Orlando Magic, Isiah Thomas said he contacted the Pacers, but he won't trade any of his young players - such as Channing Frye, Nate Robinson and David Lee - for Artest.

What the Lakers could best offer for Artest - if they refuse to trade Odom - probably would be either forward Kwame Brown or forward Devean George and teenage center Andrew Bynum.

Brown could play center for the Pacers and allow Jermaine  
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Advertisement  
 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 
 
O'Neal to play power forward. George could replace Artest at small forward and is a talented defender. Bynum was the Lakers' first-round pick and has shown potential despite being only 18.

The Lakers might stand a better chance of winning during the three years Jackson is under contract to coach by moving Bynum, though the franchise's long-term future might be best served by keeping the 7-foot-1 big man.

Odom, meanwhile, is the last player remaining from the trade that sent Shaquille O'Neal to the Miami Heat and is averaging 15.9 points, 9.4 rebounds and 5.6 assists in one of the best seasons of his career.

Jackson has said he returned to coaching with the belief that he could use Odom much as he once did Scottie Pippen in the triangle offense.

The possibility of an Odom-Artest pairing is intriguing because the two are friends from New York. Odom spoke out in support of Artest following last season's brawl and said Monday the two crossed paths a couple of times during the summer.

"He seemed like he was just ready to play," Odom said. "I was surprised by (the trade demand). You never know. ... My grandmother always said, 'You don't know what's going on in somebody else's house.' "

As coach of the Chicago Bulls, Jackson found a way to reach Dennis Rodman, the player in whose honor Artest used to wear No. 91. Jackson praised Artest on Monday as possibly being the best two-way player in the league and values his defense highly.

But trouble seems to follow Artest, and the question is whether a simple change of scenery is enough. The Lakers would ask only that Artest not be a disruption and seem to agree with what the seventh-year forward told the Indianapolis Star.

"I still think my past haunts me in this place," Artest told the newspaper. "I think somewhere else, I'm starting fresh. I'm coming in with baggage but people already know about it and how I'm going to be. Either they're going to be for me or they're not going to trade for me."

Associated Press contributed
 
http://I-Really-Shouldn't-Put-A-Link-To-A-Blog-I-Dont-Even-Update.com

Offline WayOutWest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7411
    • View Profile
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2005, 05:16:07 PM »
Hmmmmm.....Artest as a Laker?

Is he a bad guy or is he crazy?  I've read stories about the medication and shrink treatment he's under.  He seems to be one of those bi-polar type of people, he's a big lug who wouldn't hurt a fly at times at others he's a rib-cracking, fan beating malcontent.

He's a huge gamble for any team, even moreso for a team like the Lakers who's chemistry is already fragile.  If he were to become a Laker he would probably become the 2nd option, something's he's already in Indy so I would eventually fall apart.  I don't see him and Kobe working well on the court together, they would be perfect for each other off court, they are both hard workers but Artest would go COMPLETELY mad watching Kobe hoisting up 20+ shots per game.
"History shouldn't be a mystery"
"Our story is real history"
"Not his story"

"My people's culture was strong, it was pure"
"And if not for that white greed"
"It would've endured"

"Laker hate causes blindness"

rickortreat

  • Guest
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #26 on: December 15, 2005, 10:08:08 PM »
Out of all the possible trades the one that I think makes the most sense is a deal with Boston for Pierce.  Artest would be a reasonable replacement, and with the trade or without, the Celtics aren't going anywhere this year anyway.

Pierce needs to get out of Boston,  going to a real team like Indiana that has a chance would give him the stage he needs to become a big star.  He should be mentioned along with the Kobe's, McGrady's and others, but because he's on a cellar dweller like Boston, he's not on many people's lists.

In addition, what Indiana looses in defense and toughness it make up for with more potent offence from a guy who can make his own shot and tear up defences with his penetration.  

Artest would get what he deserves: a trade to a loosing team with no immediate prospects for improvement.  Then maybe he'd start to learn to shut up and think for a long time before saying yet another stupid, assinine thing!

Offline JoMal

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3361
    • View Profile
    • http://
    • Email
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #27 on: December 16, 2005, 11:21:58 AM »
And if any team had doubts about what sort of 'character' they might expect if they were foolish enough to gamble on Artest, the League fined him $10,000 yesterday for speaking up about his trade demands in public.

But that should not deter one team from pursuing him. Phil Jackson and the Lakers were fined $25,000 for "tampering" when Phil mention what a fine gentleman Chris Bosh was and in particular how he could benefit being in a Laker uniform.

Sounds like a match made in re-"fined" heaven.
"We must not confuse dissent with disloyalty.....We will not be driven by fear into an age of unreason.....We are not descended from fearful men, not from men who feared to write, to speak, to associate and to defend causes that were for the moment unpopular....We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home."

Guest_Reality

  • Guest
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #28 on: December 16, 2005, 06:46:30 PM »
Who knows if it's just spin or not, but Walsh says he has 12-15 decent offers.
He claims EC is okay, i don't buy it.

Miamis Ant Walker in a straight up deal since the salaries are similiar.  Dont tell me Phil Riley is going to grease into that.  Would Walsh really be paid off to -i mean go for- Ant Walker and nothing else?  Naw.

Updated: Dec. 16, 2005, 6:25 PM ET
Pacers encouraged by 12-15 offers for Artest

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2262997

sheep

  • Guest
Where Artest will end up
« Reply #29 on: December 16, 2005, 06:53:03 PM »
Quote
Miamis Ant Walker in a straight up deal since the salaries are similiar.  Dont tell me Phil Riley is going to grease into that.  Would Walsh really be paid off to -i mean go for- Ant Walker and nothing else?
A lot of us Lakers would follow WOW over to the Heat if they get Artest for AntWalker.