Big Ben gone to join LBJ

[WayOutWest]

Of course because of the 11 posters we have 7 are laker/spurs fans 

What fans do we have around here?  Lakers, Spurs, Jazz, 76ers, Kings, Wolves and Clippers are all represented.  Not bad considering the population.  Of course we have Reality to represent any team that is currently experiencing success.

There has always been a problem on the Cavs of who outside of Bron can score...so they trade Larry Hughes (a scorer) and Marshall (a decent 3 point shooter) for Wally and Ben Wallace?  Did they trade for the 2008 Wally or the 2002 Wally? 

I wonder if Mike Miller's asking price was too high considering there where alot of teams that could have used him, Dallas and the Cavs in particular.  IMO the Mavs would have been much better off aquiring Miller instead of Kidd and keeping Harris and Diop.

[westkoast]

Of course because of the 11 posters we have 7 are laker/spurs fans 

What fans do we have around here?  Lakers, Spurs, Jazz, 76ers, Kings, Wolves and Clippers are all represented.  Not bad considering the population.  Of course we have Reality to represent any team that is currently experiencing success.

There has always been a problem on the Cavs of who outside of Bron can score...so they trade Larry Hughes (a scorer) and Marshall (a decent 3 point shooter) for Wally and Ben Wallace?  Did they trade for the 2008 Wally or the 2002 Wally? 

I wonder if Mike Miller's asking price was too high considering there where alot of teams that could have used him, Dallas and the Cavs in particular.  IMO the Mavs would have been much better off aquiring Miller instead of Kidd and keeping Harris and Diop.

I couldn't imagine the GM of the Griz asking too much for Mike Miller unless he was trying to make up for his idiotic move earlier in the month.  Mike Miller IS a legit shooting threat and a solid rebounder.  Wally WAS a legit shooting threat.  He hasn't been a real threat since jn cheered for em.  I think that the Cavs would have benefited more from Miller's range then Ben Wallace's defense.

[Lurker]

Of course because of the 11 posters we have 7 are laker/spurs fans 

What fans do we have around here?  Lakers, Spurs, Jazz, 76ers, Kings, Wolves and Clippers are all represented.  Not bad considering the population.  Of course we have Reality to represent any team that is currently experiencing success.

There has always been a problem on the Cavs of who outside of Bron can score...so they trade Larry Hughes (a scorer) and Marshall (a decent 3 point shooter) for Wally and Ben Wallace?  Did they trade for the 2008 Wally or the 2002 Wally? 

I wonder if Mike Miller's asking price was too high considering there where alot of teams that could have used him, Dallas and the Cavs in particular.  IMO the Mavs would have been much better off aquiring Miller instead of Kidd and keeping Harris and Diop.

I couldn't imagine the GM of the Griz asking too much for Mike Miller unless he was trying to make up for his idiotic move earlier in the month.  Mike Miller IS a legit shooting threat and a solid rebounder.  Wally WAS a legit shooting threat.  He hasn't been a real threat since jn cheered for em.  I think that the Cavs would have benefited more from Miller's range then Ben Wallace's defense.

Speculation is that this is exactly what happened.  He got so much flak for the Gasol traded that he was asking more for Miller & Lowry.  Wanted a first + expirings for Miller but took crap for Gasol.

[atom2030]

What fans do we have around here?  Lakers, Spurs, Jazz, 76ers, Kings, Wolves and Clippers are all represented.

Add the BULLS in some sort of long-distance dedication. But at least since '87, so not exactly a bandwagon hopper
 

[JoMal]

What fans do we have around here?  Lakers, Spurs, Jazz, 76ers, Kings, Wolves and Clippers are all represented.

Add the BULLS in some sort of long-distance dedication. But at least since '87, so not exactly a bandwagon hopper
 

Okay, so you root LD for the bulls, but want to talk about how the deal will affect the Cavs?

How about how the backcourt of the Bulls, with Hughes (38.5 million), Hinrich (30.5 m), and Gordon (28 m if he signs for what he wants after this season), will be demanding about 97 million in payroll over the next three years. That is one heck of allot of moola to pay for what amounts to mediocre NBA guards.

[msc]

I think Wally helps the Cavs immediately with his shooting ability.  He'll get plenty of open looks and knock them down. 

Wallace, I'm not so sure about.  While a good defender, the Cavs actually already play solid D.  I'm not sure if Wallace will be enough of an upgrade on D to offset his offensive liabilities.  Varejo already is a defensive minded player who can't shoot, now you've got two of those guys on your roster. 

I don't get this move by Chicago at all.  Other than dumping a disgruntled Wallace, as JoMal points out, they're just stockpiling mediocre guards.  Isn't Sepholosia (sp?) a 2 guard as well? 

[JoMal]

Come to think of it, what, exactly, WAS the point of this trade? To make LeBron "think" the team is not sitting on its hands while all the other major teams in the east are improving? Wallace has to prove he is not washed up and one of those guys I alluded to who suddenly got old. Wally, since his knee injury, is mostly a stand and shoot player, who cannot front his opponent on defense.

Wallace's defense may be still there around the basket, but against a good jumpshooting team it will also leave the Cavs pretty vulnerable.

I don't see any of these teams getting significantly better the rest of this season, though Seattle has improved its position for free agent signings later on. Chicago will need to dump salary somehow, and the Cavs still are behind the Celtics and Pistons, IMO.

[Skandery]

I like this deal for the Cavaliers.  The Bulls and their fans have definitely poured a lot of harsh feelings in for Ben Wallace and I understand them.  Here's a young team that was over-achieving, went out and paid to get the top FA (and 5 time Defensive Player of the Year) and people were starting to talk Finals.  It fizzled and the Bulls badly regressed.  Somehow, the entire county and the media has adopted this "Ben Wallace is now useless" mantra.  I don't think so.  I think Wallace brings a lot to Cleveland and being coached by a defensive coach like Mike Brown will help him.  I also think that Z has some productive years left (at the very least this year and next) and will play alongside Ben Wallace.  That is a big frontline and I think Cleveland has never really had large defensive issues, they've now become that much better with Ben Wallace.  Many of them play good team defense and I consider Varejao one of the top unsung defenders in the NBA.  Now Wally is the player that makes this really sweet for Cleveland because, unlike Hughes, actually can be counted on to score at a somewhat decent clip and can be counted on to be on the court.  Hughes was abysmally inefficient, VERY inefficient, and while he racked up steals, had to gamble in the passing lanes and through the team defense out of order to get them, and he had a ridiculously bad contract.  If I were a Cavs fan, I'd be on my knees thankin the good lord that Larry Hughes is FINALLY off the team. 

As for why Chicago and Seattle obliged to help Cleveland put together this sweet deal, I'm at a loss.  Yes Chigaco gets more time to develop those young bigs and Seattle got more draft picks, but those gains are much less than what Cleveland just did for themselves. 

[atom2030]

the Cavs got two 33yr old frontcourt people and a 31 yr old shooter.
not exactly what will get you a dynasty, and nothing that will have the rest of the league worried too much.
(or do you honestly expect a "oh damn, how shall we beat the Cavs now" outcry coming from anywhere? Thought so ...)

and for the Bulls this was addition by substraction, with Hughes or Gordan (depending on the next 2 months) on his way to a S&T relocation. Gooden might stick, but might not play much of a major role.

Pax stated the Bulls went for contracts, rather than players, and despite Larry/Ben having almost identical contracts, he believes a 29yr old Hughes, while erratic, is easier to move than a 34yr old Wallace next offseason.

[Randy]

the Cavs got two 33yr old frontcourt people and a 31 yr old shooter.
not exactly what will get you a dynasty, and nothing that will have the rest of the league worried too much.
(or do you honestly expect a "oh damn, how shall we beat the Cavs now" outcry coming from anywhere? Thought so ...)

and for the Bulls this was addition by substraction, with Hughes or Gordan (depending on the next 2 months) on his way to a S&T relocation. Gooden might stick, but might not play much of a major role.

Pax stated the Bulls went for contracts, rather than players, and despite Larry/Ben having almost identical contracts, he believes a 29yr old Hughes, while erratic, is easier to move than a 34yr old Wallace next offseason.

Atom,

Couldn't agree more -- the Bulls got rid of Wallace (and most didn't think they could do that with the size of contract and his play over the past two years).  What they added WILL make them better offensively, I believe, but worse defensively.

As I posted before, I believe this trade had EVERYTHING to do with Ferry feeling like he had to do something or risk alienating King James.  I still think this comes back to bite the Cavs and it does nothing to satisfy LBJ.  Ferry just swapped some cards but the deck is about the same -- look for LeBron to get more frustrated in coming years.