Francis for McGrady deal now official

[JoMal]

News

The long-rumored trade between the Houston Rockets and Orlando Magic was finalized on Tuesday. The Rockets will obtain All-Star shooting guard and league-leading scorer Tracy McGrady, forward Juwan Howard, and point guards Reece Gaines and Tyronn Lue from the Magic in exchange for All-Star point guard Steve Francis, shooting guard Cuttino Mobley, and forward/center Kelvin Cato. A formal announcement is expected on Wednesday afternoon, and the Rockets official web site is already running a promotion telling fans to come greet their new superstar.

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The Rockets suddenly look a lot like the Lakers recent championship squads, with the dynamic duo of McGrady and Yao Ming surrounded by guys like Howard, Lue, and Jim Jackson. The worry for T-Mac fans is that the Yao-based offense in Houston will limit his scoring stats, as Tracy basically had free reign to fire away in Orlando. The move to the Magic should free up Francis and Mobley to get back to the fatter stats they posted prior to the disappointing 2003-04 season. From an athletic and entertaining standpoint, the Magic now have a pretty agile cast with Francis, Mobley, Cato, Drew Gooden, Dwight Howard, Jameer Nelson, and Keith Bogans. Of course, that assumes that the Magic won't turn around and ship Mobley and Cato elsewhere.

While Houston likely will benefit from getting McGrady more, Tracy also has gotten used to being the "guy", and Yao needs to be the main man going into his third year. Orlando gets Francis, but more importantly Mobley, who should be a better guy to have. Francis just does not twist my shorts that much.

[ziggy]

Orlando blew this by monumental proportions :bash:  :bash: .  Tracy McGrady is one of the top 5 or 6 players in the league and this is all they could get!?!

Steve Francis is the MOST overrated player in the NBA  :puke: .  He is a turnover machine, who wants to be the guy, but he doesn't have that talent.  He is not a good decision maker, and he is a very poor shooter.  He is a cry baby cancer, and he HAS NOT improved much at all since coming into the league.

Kelvin Cato is a stiff, always has been a stiff, and always will be a stiff.  

The only player they got that has the talent to justify his salary is Cuttino Mobley.  He is a good solid player.

Orlando now has Steve Francis as their "Franchise" player for the next 6 years.

Portland supposedly offered Randolph, Derek Anderson, and Dale Davis for McGrady and Howard.  Randolph is a better player now than Francis, and you have 2 more years at $3 to $4 million, plus he is only 22 years old.  :bash:

DA isn't as good as Mobley, but he is comparable.

Davis is a stiff, just like Cato, but he has the biggest contract you are getting and it is done in one year not 6 years like Francis.  This was a far better deal for Orlando.

[westkoast]

I have to agree that T-mac/Ming combo is probably the closest thing we will get to a Shaq/Kobe in a long time.  I have no doubt in my mind that T-mac will bend his game to fit Yao's......however im not sure that Yao will be able to dominate in the post enough for Mac.  Tracy has been on his own doing everything and taking all the blame long enough, you know he is itching to go somewhere with help.

Plus Van Gundy will finally get him to play defense which is what T-mac needs to go over the top IMO.

Orlando's front office is smoking something real good....I wonder if they got it from Lurker.

[Guest_Randy]

The Rockets just ROBBED the Magic blind -- isn't this the same GM who was voted GM of the year several years ago?  I just CAN'T believe that the Magic pulled this trade -- sure, they dumped Howard but they got the most overrated ego in the league -- and his game DOESN'T support his ego!   Mobley is a decent piece in the puzzle but Calvin Kato is a one-dimensional wannabee wonder -- a decent post defender, great shotblocker (when he is in good shape) and average rebounder -- and then you get Francis who is quick and likes to shoot (both the basketball AND his mouth) but that's about all.  Mobley is a good slasher and an underrated defender -- he also is a streaky shooter (but his shooting percentage is going down without a big man in the middle).  

The Rockets?  They add the 2nd best SG in the league -- arguably the 2nd best backcourt player in the league.  A great shooter from anywhere on the floor, can create his own shot and is a VERY good defender if he puts his mind to it (JVG will help him put his mind to it).  Then they also add Juwann Howard who isn't worth the hype he once received but is a VERY solid role player -- esp. when paired with two players who are going to get a LOT of double-teams (TMac and Yao).  The Rockets need a decent PG now -- Lue is okay but he is much better as a backup (can Houston afford Troy Hudson?).  
Look at Houston's line-up:
 PG - Tyrone Lue
 SG - TMac
 SF - Jimmy Jackson
 PF - Juwann Howard
 C  - Yao Ming

This is a VERY good starting line-up.  Two VERY good defenders in TMac and Jackson and a decent offensive player in Howard when the opposing PF doubles down.  The Rockets DEFINATELY look like playoff material although they need to do some work in strengthening their bench.

[Lurker]

Nope, Randy not the same GM....he was canned.  This is a new GM.

To a certain degree Orlando was handcuffed.  McGrady basically said he would only resign with Houston.  And while I agree Francis is overrated as a point guard he is another version of Iverson....jack up enough shots and some of them will fall (sorry, Sixer fans).  If you look at stats basically Tmac = Francis/Mobley.  

Ziggy, I don't believe that Portland offered Zach for TMac.  They are trying to shop their other forwards in an effort to keep Zach as their franchise player.  And I don't saee the Blazers giving up Zach so they could have TMac for 2 years.

And koast....I would never share my GOOD stuff with non-Texans.  They must have got some of that stuff that WOW uses before going to Clipper games.

[Joe Vancil]

I personally don't think this is a robbery - Orlando might have even gotten the better of the deal, getting 3 starters in exchange for one.

Despite all this talk of Francis's "selfishness," the fact remains that he's one of the top young point guards in the league.  He's a great rebounder at point, and he's capable of running an up-tempo offense - one which will suit the young Magic.  It's in the slow-down game where he struggles.

Mobley is solid, solid, solid.  Nothing special, and maybe a bit shot-happy, but Mobley isn't going to cost you games.

Cato is exactly the kind of pickup Orlando needs.  He'll immediately be installed as the starting center, and he'll provide strong help for a weak frontcourt.

McGrady is McGrady.  We've not seen how willing he is to share the spotlight, because he's never had to.  I don't see him faring any better under Van Gundy's system than Francis did.

Howard is a bum.  A big, over-priced, over-rated stiff.  Expect him to back up Mo Taylor...not the other way around.

Lue isn't starter-quality, but he had a good year for the Magic this past season.  That's because having a mediocre year for anyone else would have been equal to having a good year for the Magic.  If Lue is starting, the Rockets are in trouble, because Lue is an accelerator on the offense.  He likes to push tempo.  That's a bad fit for Van Gundy.

Yeah...I'm pretty sure that I like Orlando's side of the deal better.

 

[westkoast]

And koast....I would never share my GOOD stuff with non-Texans.  They must have got some of that stuff that WOW uses before going to Clipper games.

Its got to be the Tequila and the Tijuana hookers that did this to the Orlando front office.

[rickortreat]

Houston got a great deal out of this.  T-Mac puts Houston much closer to a title.  Orlando won't even make the playoffs.

Houston still has a lot of work to do.  Juwann will not be the PF they need.  Jackson isn't a great SF, but having T-mac around will get him a lot of open looks.

Lue is not a good player or point.  Why do you think he keeps getting traded.

Houston is in need of a couple of good floor leaders to distribute the ball and let T-Mac run without it.  Not sure if Yao is the post player he'll need to be to get the Rockets the title, but we'll get to see how close he is this year.  Probably overmatched against the Duncans and Garnetts.  

[JoMal]

I personally don't think this is a robbery - Orlando might have even gotten the better of the deal, getting 3 starters in exchange for one.

Despite all this talk of Francis's "selfishness," the fact remains that he's one of the top young point guards in the league.  He's a great rebounder at point, and he's capable of running an up-tempo offense - one which will suit the young Magic.  It's in the slow-down game where he struggles.

Mobley is solid, solid, solid.  Nothing special, and maybe a bit shot-happy, but Mobley isn't going to cost you games.

Cato is exactly the kind of pickup Orlando needs.  He'll immediately be installed as the starting center, and he'll provide strong help for a weak frontcourt.

McGrady is McGrady.  We've not seen how willing he is to share the spotlight, because he's never had to.  I don't see him faring any better under Van Gundy's system than Francis did.

Howard is a bum.  A big, over-priced, over-rated stiff.  Expect him to back up Mo Taylor...not the other way around.

Lue isn't starter-quality, but he had a good year for the Magic this past season.  That's because having a mediocre year for anyone else would have been equal to having a good year for the Magic.  If Lue is starting, the Rockets are in trouble, because Lue is an accelerator on the offense.  He likes to push tempo.  That's a bad fit for Van Gundy.

Yeah...I'm pretty sure that I like Orlando's side of the deal better.

Can't agree, Joe, about Francis.

The problem with him is he is better suited as a SG, not a point. He does NOT run the offense all that well, in the up tempo OR the slowed down half-court. Lurker is exactly right in comparing him to Iverson. I can't stand him as a point guard, but I might be able to live with his shot selection as a shooting guard.

I also believe that the Magic are not done dealing. What I've heard suggested is that Mobley and Cato will be packaged in another trade.

Hopefully for a better point guard then Francis.

[Lurker]

Can't agree, Joe, about Francis.

The problem with him is he is better suited as a SG, not a point. He does NOT run the offense all that well, in the up tempo OR the slowed down half-court. Lurker is exactly right in comparing him to Iverson. I can't stand him as a point guard, but I might be able to live with his shot selection as a shooting guard.

I also believe that the Magic are not done dealing. What I've heard suggested is that Mobley and Cato will be packaged in another trade.

Hopefully for a better point guard then Francis.

Don't forget that Orlando got Jameer nelson in the draft also.  I could see Nelson at the point & Francis at sg for the Magic at times this season.

[Ted]

I'm closer to Joe's point of view on this trade.

Francis, although he did nothing for my fantasy team last year, can be a very good player. His FG% just went down the drains last year, but in past years, he hasn't been that bad. And he is probably the best rebounding PG in the league. His assist numbers have been pretty good in the past. In fact, I think one year he almost reached the 20/6/6 plateau. He didn't do well in Van Gundy's system, but then again, when has a multi-tooled guard really been able to bust loose under JVG?

Mobley is a nice player. He has good range, and very good athleticism, and is actually a quite decent defender.

Cato has been improving every year, and actually had his best year while backing up Yao last season. He could actually flourish in Orlando with more playing time.

McGrady on the other hand, is of course, one of the top talents in the league. But I liken him to more of a Vince Carter rather than a Michael Jordan. One of the former NBA players who hosts the morning sports radio show here in UT has a close friend in the Orlando organization. And he said that the Magic had reached the point where they wanted to get rid of TMac more than they wanted to keep him around.

The source said that TMac is not the kind of person who inspires camaraderie or trust in teammates. When the players of the team arrange to get together to work out on their own, and there's only one guy (TMac) who NEVER shows up, teammates start to wonder about him. When a player quits on his team and chases a personal goal (the scoring title) before the all star break, teammates wonder about him. I don't think TMac is a leader in any way shape or form. And he puts in about as much effort on D as his high-flying cousin from the great white north. No, TMac isn't going to make Houston contenders. If anyone does, it'll be Yao.

As far as Francis being a cancer. I don't know. Personally, I think JVG is an idiot when it comes to coaching athletic players. There are ways to run an offense through a center and still have it be fast and flowing (see the Lakers of 2000-2002). JVG's offense is sludge and I personally can't blame Francis for hating it.

[rickortreat]

That's a really valid point about VanGundy Ted!  I always dislike his coaching style, particularly his offense.  

With a young Yao, and a great open floor player like T-Mac, you want an uptempo team.  Has VG ever coached an uptempo team?  Hmm, wonder where Phil will wind up coaching  again?  

[JoMal]

 

He didn't do well in Van Gundy's system, but then again, when has a multi-tooled guard really been able to bust loose under JVG?

That may be true, but I disliked Francis BEFORE Van Gundy showed up, and while Jeff is more of a defensive coach, his team did quite well under him. But I always wondered how much better they would have been if a real point ran the show and not Francis.

When a player quits on his team and chases a personal goal (the scoring title) before the all star break, teammates wonder about him. I don't think TMac is a leader in any way shape or form. And he puts in about as much effort on D as his high-flying cousin from the great white north. No, TMac isn't going to make Houston contenders. If anyone does, it'll be Yao.

McGrady's teamates sucked. They needed the extra work and I would think that Tracy may have "quit" on them because his management there never gave him anybody to play with. I withhold my opinion of him and what he might do until Van Gundy coaches him for a while. If Larry Brown can make Rasheed Wallace appear to be a solid citizen, then why not Van Gundy making McGrady more of a team player.

 

[Ted]

Rick, you're absolutely right. With young athletes like McGrady and Yao, the Rockets offense should be a high-flying dunk fest, especially with Yao's passing ability. But I foresee a lot of McGrady threes and a lot of Yao Ming back downs and turnaround jumpers. Just think Patrick Ewing and you'll remember what JVG does with a premier big man. If he can change his spots and work their athleticism into Houston's offense, the Rockets could be quite a team to watch.

Oh yeah, and McGrady has to play D.

JoMal, I totally understand you. I don't really like Francis either. I didn't like the way he entered the league (see also Kobe) and I don't like a lot of his game (see shot selection and turnovers). But he could be a better player. But the only other athletic guard I can think of who really flourished with VG is Starks, and he knew his place much better than Franchise did in Houston. NOTE: Allen Houston IS NOT an athletic guard. And Latrell Sprewell IS and athletic guard, but was not allowed to play guard in NY.

[Guest_Randy]

Ted, TMac runs the floor VERY well -- Yao does not.  In fact, if you want Yao in a running game, you haven't seen him play much.  He isn't as slow as Shaq but pretty close -- and if you DO put him in a running game, it begins to limit his minutes on the floor (and that's not good for Houston).

TMac is a VERY good defensive player although he doesn't prove it very often -- I think he will under JVG.  I have said for YEARS that JVG is a lot like Popovich -- BOTH of these coaches need to hire strong offensive assistants who can help put together a decent offensive scheme.  Both are GREAT defensive coaches but their offense schemes leave a LOT to be desired.  I think that TMac and Yao provide an in-and-out scheme that would fit very well into the triangle -- although I doubt that JVG will be adopting that scheme.  My guess is that he will use Pop's version of offense -- dump down into the post or allow TMac to create.  I still think that they will be a playoff team this next year -- Jimmy Jackson is a GREAT team player, an underrated defender, decent shooter, very good ballhandler and a hustle player and that bodes well for Houston with TMac and Yao along with whatever PF and PG they put on the floor.