Financial Folks - WHat's it Mean

[westkoast]

Skandery please explain to me how my comment shows that I am uninformed or getting the wool pulled over my eyes by marketing when it comes to this car? If anything I think your comment shows your lack of knowledge of areas outside of your own.   Before you answer let me remind you I was speaking about when the electric car was first being hyped to come out.  Let's not take the quote out of the time frame it was referencing as it is apart of my point.


Let's use California as an example since we buy the most cars in the country and consumers in this state could tip the scales.  Again referencing when the car was first suppose to be introduced...  the electric car was not able to travel far distances and that is why they started to pair the traditional engine up with the battery.  Pretty sure everyone knows that the technology has got much better AND they have started putting in charge stations all over the place (at least in So Cal).  That wasn't true in the early part of this decade.  I bet in MOST places in this country there is not places you can stop and get a hardy charge if you were en route to a friend of families house who lives 200-300 miles away RIGHT NOW.    If you are thinking that 100+ miles a day is a "rare" trip I can tell you it is not for people who commute.  There was a point in time where I was driving 120 miles round trip A DAY.  I know plenty of people who drive from San Bernadino area to Orange County or the outskirts of LA County.  80+ miles each direction.  Have friends who drive from NJ up into Penn who do 50+ miles each direction.  Most of us would drive an electric car if it made sense for us. 

And really Skandery in places like California, where we don't have enough power in the summer for people to run their ACs, don't really have the ability to handle a large amount of electric cars plugging into the power grid.  We have rolling black outs for a reason.  Pretty sure it's not just for fun.  California is the state that sells the most cars, gets reamed the most for gas, residents tend to drive the most miles on average each year, and one of the more hippy-green pushing states yet no one has taken up to the electric car in droves.   It's a little bit more then 'marketing' so we feel 'secure'.  If I am running late from Orange County and I need to be in Downtown LA for a meeting, if the electric car is low I am screwed because I would have to go way out of my way to find a charging station.  If I have a gas powered OR a hybrid I can hit Cheveron before I jump into the 405 traffic and take a straight shot.  I can fill my Civic up to the top in like 6-7 minutes.  A charge from the wall in my garage to the car will not be that fast.  While I've heard of the ability to get it ~ 10 minutes (only in a LAB though) I still am not able to just pull over and do that in THOUSANDS of locations.  Could I charge it at night? Sure.  Could someone if the lived in an apartment complex?  Maybe...if they had a garage since most parking spots don't come equipped with an electrical outlet. 

The idea of an electric car is great and I would pay for one *IF* it was cheaper, it was time for me to get a new car, and there was more charging stations placed.  At the same time I am being a realist here, it's just a bit more then "marketing" and people being "uninformed" like you seem to think.

[jemagee]

Skandery

I still don't understand it tons but after seeing that movie I mentioned earlier I actually know some of the things you are referencing in your post that I wouldn't have before watching the film. 

[Skandery]

Skandery please explain to me how my comment shows that I am uninformed or getting the wool pulled over my eyes by marketing when it comes to this car?

Westkoat, I didn't mean you had the wool over your eyes.  Basically your comment echoes the widespread "chicken-or-egg" dilemma.  Well, we don't have the infrastructure and the technology is limited, so why bother?  If the Automobile industry marketed the cars to sell and as a result more people buy it, the demand for infrastructure will be met.  Peripheral costs will go down due to economies of scale.  The technology, itself, can be further channeled as advancements in other areas progress: hybrid and fuel cells. 

Where would the internal combustion engine have gone if everybody in 1915 said "Well, I'm NOT buying this automobile thingamajig, there are no gas stations around". 

Basically everyone gave up at first opportunity and GM was all too happy to let it happen.  GM commissioned customer surveys that went out to interested consumers that EMPHASIZED the drawbacks of the car.  What Company does this?  CARB repealed the "Zero Emission" Regulation in part based on these survey's.

I still don't understand it tons but after seeing that movie I mentioned earlier I actually know some of the things you are referencing in your post that I wouldn't have before watching the film.

Actually jem, just watching the film puts you in an elite class of understanding when it comes to the electric car.  Most people around simply never knew it was an option!!  I mean in your original post you mentioned limitations.  Sure a full charge carried you only 100-150 miles based on how you drive and conditions (stop-n-go, etc.).  All of us (like Westkoast) know people who are the exceptions that go over that in a commute; but most people don't.  The percentage nation-wide, I believe is in the high 90s (96 or 97%), of people who don't top 100 miles in single day of driving.  The percentage in the state of California is lower than the rest of the country but is still a high majority, like 90%.  Would appreciate if someone looked up the actual numbers, I can't seem to find it.

Heck lets take a poll on the board:
How many people exceed 100 miles per day driving on average?
How many people knew the GM EV-1 was a 100% electric car you (or your parents) could buy in 1996?

I'm a NO on both.

[JoMal]

It would be nice if the introduction of the electric car could solve all the problems we are facing regarding the economy, but the issues inherent in the system go far beyond a fix of commuting habits.

[westkoast]

Westkoat, I didn't mean you had the wool over your eyes.  Basically your comment echoes the widespread "chicken-or-egg" dilemma.  Well, we don't have the infrastructure and the technology is limited, so why bother?  If the Automobile industry marketed the cars to sell and as a result more people buy it, the demand for infrastructure will be met.  Peripheral costs will go down due to economies of scale.  The technology, itself, can be further channeled as advancements in other areas progress: hybrid and fuel cells. 

Would it really be met fast enough?  This is where we disagree.  Out of all the states I've traveled to in the last 2-3 years California seems to be the one that is going in the right direction as far as building up that infrastructure yet it still lacks quite a bit.  *SOME* gas stations, amusement parks, and malls have spots to charge.  You would still need those to be built onto apartment complexes, condos, at the beach, up in RV parks, outside of resturants, and at sporting events.     We do love the hybrids out here.  They make the most sense at this point in time due to how we operate out here in California.  Ready republicans/conservatives........the only way I see something like that happening is if the government stepped in and kicked business owners (or gave them incentives) to adopt the technology early.  You think a guy who owns a gas station is going to spend thousands to put in a charging station just for fun?

Does anyone own a Honda here?  These cars tend to last a real long time.  There is no argument for me to trade my Civic (which gets 360+ miles per tank) in for an electric car anytime soon.  A couple years of ago when more people were buying cars I think the lack of LEGIT electric cars pushed them to make purchases of more efficient gas powered cars.  What's the life cycle for cars for most people? 5 years?  Maybe when we start to climb out of this recession and the electric car technology has matured some more you will see a switch.  It doesn't make sense right now and it certainly didn't 5 years ago.

Where would the internal combustion engine have gone if everybody in 1915 said "Well, I'm NOT buying this automobile thingamajig, there are no gas stations around". 

It's easier to transport, store, and fill a gas tank up then it is to transport, store, and fully charge a battery for most people.  That's the difference between the two.