Author Topic: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah  (Read 8610 times)

Offline anklebreaker

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #15 on: November 11, 2008, 10:03:13 PM »
Brand honestly looks like a shadow of his former self.  I'm not saying that's what he's become, but his play has been underwhelming to say the least.  He got tied up on several occasions going to the hoop, he got the chair pulled on him by Millsap, and his shot left a lot to be desired...things that are not typical of Brand's game.   He's better than this... we just haven't gotten to see it yet. 

Lou has to be livid.  He gets 13 minutes against Orlando and 17 minutes tonight.  We need him on the floor more than that.

jemagee

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #16 on: November 11, 2008, 10:04:47 PM »
So has anyone changed on Mo yet?

Offline tk76

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #17 on: November 11, 2008, 10:12:37 PM »
I still think Mo is a good coach for an uptempo team.  He does what an uptempo team needs- he is a player's coach who keeps his team loose and motivated.  His players are not afraid to take risks.

A coach like Sloan- as good as he is- would not be well suited for an uptempo squad.  Same with LB.  Both are demanding of low risk and precise execution.  Both put their players under stess and leave players in their doghouse.  This works well in running an efficient, mistake free half court offense, but no with an uptempo team.

I see the Sixers as mostly a collection of players suited for a wide open, uptemo style plus Brand.  Maybe they can make the pieces all fit, but its looked vey ugly so far.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2008, 10:14:11 PM by tk76 »

Offline anklebreaker

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #18 on: November 11, 2008, 10:19:38 PM »
Besides the fact that we're 7 games into the season and still look unprepared, I haven't been happy with Mo's minute distribution at all this season... and our half court offense obviously... well.... still doesn't exist.

I thought we defended the 3 a little better, but overall our defense still looks weak.  They had 31 assists on 38 fg's tonight, pretty much picking us apart.... we got beat on the glass, turned it over more, and shot a lower %.  Overall, we were the inferior team for 3 solid quarters.  

Offline tk76

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #19 on: November 11, 2008, 10:37:07 PM »
The Sixers are about to ace a run of lousy teams coming up.  Teams that will let them get out and run.

This will help the Sixers confidence, but also will mask the major problems this team has on both sides of the ball.

Offline Derek Bodner

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #20 on: November 11, 2008, 10:47:23 PM »
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I'm not saying they could be contenders with Thad at PF.  I just wonder if Ed dropped the ball by going for Brand instead of getting a more uptempo PF.

You build your team around your best players, not get mediocre players to complement a mediocre team.   If the pieces don't fit (and I'm not sure they do), then you build around Brand and Thad as a base IMO.

Offline Skates

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #21 on: November 11, 2008, 10:51:30 PM »
I understand Utah beating us when they have the ball, they execute beautifully in the half court.  But this was a game where we should have done better offensively.  Utah does not double team much and Boozer, while strong, is not a shot-blocker.  Funny thing is Brand and Boozer are pretty equivalent players, essentially 20 and 10 guys, both a tad short at PF.  The rest of their starters were Koufos a rookie, Brewer who is a very good defender and a decent shooter, but not close to dominant as a player or shooter, CJ Miles and Deron Williams, passing well but shooting poorly coming off of the injury.  

My point being, there is no reason our starting five can't play as well or better than their's, especially when Deron is less than 100%.  Their outside shooting is not spectacular without Okur, and Boozer, like Brand, is a pure pick and roll/pop player, not a Dwight Howard type beast on the low block constantly.  Our team is more athletic and are a decent match-up at every position except PG.  But the reason they took us apart is simple, they execute plays far better than we do.  They are far better coached and more disciplined and certainly some of their players have better basketball smarts than ours do.

We can bitch about our personnel all we want, and some changes will be made down the road, but this team is ill-prepared todefend or play offense in the half court.

I also don't see Brand at PF as the problem.  Thad at PF was a short term gimmick that worked against tired and tanking teams down the stretch.  This team should be able to run with Brand, he runs well, rebounds and blocks shots, he's not a lumbering stiff.  The running game is bad because the defense is so bad and the defense to offense transition, when we finally force a TO, is out of sync too.  Mo is out of his league coaching a team like this and it is showing up big time.  This is the best they can do, against a team that does not swarm on D, after 4 solid days of practice?

Offline tk76

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #22 on: November 11, 2008, 11:01:52 PM »
My problem isn't with Brand.  I just worry that the other players on the team (aside from Thad) are not well suited to play next to Brand.  Its not exactly ideal to start turning over the roster to build around a PF who will soon be on the wrong side of 30- after you jad a team that had great chemistry built around an uptempo game.

I agree that you should build around your 2 best players (Brand and Thad) and not just have athletes with limited potential to win- but they just gave Iguodala 80M so he is not going anywhere.

I thought Iguodala could be a good half court complementary player who is devastating on the break (and could generate break chances on defense.)  He is looking more like a Desmond Mason type who is only good on the break.

I realize this comes across as over-reacting.  I still see this team winning 45+ games this year, even without a major move.  But I think the issues that are holding them back now could very well re-emerge in a playoff situation, as the game slows down.  I'm far from convinced that this team is that much better in the half court than they were last year.  Not because I have a problem with Brand, but because most of the rest of the roster (esp Sam, Iguodala and Lou) don't work well with Brand.

Offline Skates

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #23 on: November 11, 2008, 11:13:43 PM »
Some personnel changes are needed, so is a coaching change.  Brand's game is not all that hard to play with, he has essentially the same skills as Boozer and Utah does a tremendous job of playing within themselves.  I can see one or two players not being a perfect fit, but when the vast majority of the players who have had success in the past are functionally useless, well, I look no further than the head coach.

Offline Derek Bodner

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #24 on: November 11, 2008, 11:26:10 PM »
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but when the vast majority of the players who have had success in the past are functionally useless, well, I look no further than the head coach.

Keep in mind a younger Brand and a younger Miller played with a slashing SG, lanky SF, and offensively limited C before.  They won 27 games.

If they can do that when Brand was 23 and Miller was 26, then can do it at 29 and 32 as well.

Offline tk76

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #25 on: November 11, 2008, 11:26:17 PM »
Do you think Iguodala and Brand can play well off each other?

I would have said yes entering this year, but now I'm not sure.

Offline Derek Bodner

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #26 on: November 11, 2008, 11:28:15 PM »
They could if Young was a consistent top offensive option (20+ points), had a C with a clue offensively, and a PG who could hit an open shot.

If Iguodala was a legitimate 3rd option, it could work.  A guy who you only NEEDED 15 pts, 6 rebounds, 4 assists from.  But that requires a #1 option who is ready to be a #1 option, and a #2 option who doesn't have his best moves taken away by a PG with no range and a C who gets in his way.

Someone mentioned Utah as an example.  If we had Williams replacing Miller and Okur replacing Dalembert, our half court problems would be vastly different.

Williams and Boozer, with Okur there to open up the lane, are tailor made for the pick and roll.  Miller with his weak first step and no outside shot, surrounded with horrible floor spacing and a clueless C aren't.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2008, 11:33:40 PM by Derek Bodner »

Offline tk76

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2008, 11:37:32 PM »
Well, Young is probably only a year away from being a reliable 20 ppg scorer. 

Speights might be the answer at center in 1-2 years. 

But I doubt Lou is the answer at shooting PG- so I guess that's the move they need to make.  And then wait 1-2 years and hope it all comes together before Brand starts to decline.

I hate having to be patient.

Offline rickortreat

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2008, 11:39:22 PM »
I think the only thing we need is patience.  The Sixers were in the game, and dominated in the third quarter. For a change I liked Mo's substitutions, but they did not perform and when they didn't is when Utah took control.

When Lou Williams is shooting 2-8 and Thad Young goes 3-15 we need other players to step up and no one did.  Consider that if they made a normal percentage of their shots the Sixers would have been right with the Jazz, who they managed to hold to a 43.7% shooting.  Too bad for the Sixers that they shot 38.2%!

Brand hasn't given us 20 pts. yet.  Iguodala hasn't either, but in the last 2 games he has played very well, even if he hasn't scored a lot of points.  He came very close to a triple double 2 games ago and tonight he had 15 pts. 10 reb. and 5 assists.  

I can't blame Cheeks for the bone-headed plays, because the team managed to play for a while like the team I remember from last year, that squeezed the life out of teams.  Utah is an elite team, however, and the Sixers don't have the discipline to beat a team like that yet.  They are good enough defensively, but aren't yet on offense, and that should come with time.

If we're a player short, it's because we didn't get a good enough free agent over the summer.  It might be better to see Donyell Marshall rather than Ivey or Rush.

Offline DuckyNinja

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Re: Next Game - Nov 11 Utah
« Reply #29 on: November 12, 2008, 02:52:49 AM »
I missed the game, so I'm basing these thoughts based only on the boxscore:

-Thad Young looks like he's trying too hard now.  He wasn't good the previous game and he was gawdawful this game.  He's trying to step up and failing miserably.  Just not ready to make the next leap.  Should never play 40+ minutes this year unless the letters OT are involved.

-The bench kills this team.  They say you get what you pay for, and we're paying a little and getting little production.  This is a 6 man team.  You can't win the NBA with a 6 man team.  It just doesn't work.  When we were uptempo last year, some guys who were generally bad were not as bad.  Now we have guys who are bad and have nothing to hide them.

-Brand had 6 blocked shots.  Wow.  He's barely rebounding though.  I guess that's to happen when you have 3 other very good rebounders in the same lineup.

-We are 2-0 when scoring more than 100 and 0-5 when scoring less than 90.  We have yet to score between 90 and 110 yet.