Author Topic: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?  (Read 2665 times)

Offline rickortreat

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WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« on: November 06, 2008, 02:15:06 PM »
I thought it was Cheeks and his inability to establish a rotation.  But last night against Miami, they played terribly. It's like they forgot how they got there, by out-hustling and outworking other teams.  In fact Miami outworked them, something that should never happen.

I think that on offense they lack the continuity they need to be effective.  When they are running and free-lancing they're fine, but in a half-court offense, they don't seem to have any set play that they can run time after time and get a basket or a foul.

I can't blame Cheeks for his players not working hard. The only thing I can blame him for is not being a good offensive coach, one that understands that the team needs a couple of plays where every player is in a specific area for a specific purpose, and is not just standing around.  When the point guard is moving, but everyone else is standing still, of course the team will have a tough time generating shots.

The only offense is coming from Thad Young, who has now developed an outside shot. It's a good addition, but cancelled out by Andre Iguodala's decline.  He seems lost.  He doesn't get any touches, doesn't use screens and goes to the weak side of the floor on offense. To a certain extent he should know what to do, but again it's Cheeks responsibility to see how to get his players involved, and run plays if necessary.

The team appears to have outside shooters and very solid rebounding.  Add to that a solid inside post presence and the Sixers should be winning.  But they're not going to win anything if they let themselves get outworked.


jemagee

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2008, 02:23:21 PM »


nothings 'wrong' with the sixers that hasn't been wrong in the past - unrealistic expectations from the fanbase fueled by the media might be the problem - the faulty belief that Mo Cheeks is a good NBA coach (he never should have been hired) - continued excusing the poor play of some players while iguodala is thrown under the bus (or have you missed how crappy andre miller has been this season) - a not very good bench built by everones favorite GM in Ed STefanski (there is not one GOOD back up PG on this entire roster aside form Iguodala, and Iguodala at point confuses Mo Cheeks who's man crush on willie green must end)

The sixers are a mediocre team - mediocre teams have good days and bad days - and they end up mediocre - mediocre will get you into the eastern playoffs - but the championship talk that started when they acquired brand was premature and overly optimistic to say the least
« Last Edit: November 06, 2008, 02:26:14 PM by jemagee »

Offline rickortreat

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2008, 03:19:27 PM »
Miller is definitely part of the problem, especially on defense where the rest of the team has to cover for his deficiencies.

If Iguodala can play the point, he should take over and start running plays.  Even if they are in a half-court doesn't mean there isn't a tempo or rhythm it's played at. Maybe if Williams would pass the ball a little it would help.  The 2nd group hasn't had much time to develop yet since Cheeks can't make up his mind.

But isn't it interesting that Young continues to be able to get shots and make a high percentage while Iguodala doesn't even get involved?


jemagee

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2008, 03:29:12 PM »
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If Iguodala can play the point, he should take over and start running plays.  Even if they are in a half-court doesn't mean there isn't a tempo or rhythm it's played at. Maybe if Williams would pass the ball a little it would help.  The 2nd group hasn't had much time to develop yet since Cheeks can't make up his mind.

I've been advocating Iguodala at the point since he got here - even just as back up - but it seems a concept too complex for the sixers to grasp.

Williams isn't a point guard mentality - Iguodala has more of a passers mentality than Wlliams (though he needs to stop with the fancy behind the back crap all the time - too many turnovers) - if the sixers plan is still Louis Williams starting point guard i cry tears.

Andre Millers problems aren't just defensive, he's shooting too much and turning the ball over too much

Offline rickortreat

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2008, 03:38:35 PM »
If Williams can't play point it's a problem, because he's too small to be a 2 guard and defend.

The truth is, in the NBA if you're 6' 3" or under you have to play the point if you want to play.  Otherwise, you're just a second string scorer.


Offline Lurker

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2008, 03:53:43 PM »
The truth is, in the NBA if you're 6' 3" or under you have to play the point if you want to play.  Otherwise, you're just a second string scorer.

Isn't Iverson a SG rick?  Guess he has always been just a second string scorer.
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jemagee

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2008, 04:08:10 PM »
How tall is brandon roy?  Monta ellis?



Offline rickortreat

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #7 on: November 06, 2008, 04:09:20 PM »
The truth is, in the NBA if you're 6' 3" or under you have to play the point if you want to play.  Otherwise, you're just a second string scorer.

Isn't Iverson a SG rick?  Guess he has always been just a second string scorer.

No, just a defensive liability who has never won a championship.

jemagee

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2008, 04:10:50 PM »
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No, just a defensive liability who has never won a championship.

He guards point guards - he plays shooting guard - i don't see why that's so complicated.

You say 'never won a championship' like it diminishes him as a player - he had crap support in philadelphia and still has neever had the right kind of PF to play with him (in my opinion) but might have him now - we'll see - i don't think so

Offline Lurker

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2008, 04:34:57 PM »
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No, just a defensive liability who has never won a championship.

He guards point guards - he plays shooting guard - i don't see why that's so complicated.

You say 'never won a championship' like it diminishes him as a player - he had crap support in philadelphia and still has neever had the right kind of PF to play with him (in my opinion) but might have him now - we'll see - i don't think so

You don't have the history here...up until the Sixers traded Iverson, rick believed him to be the best SG in the league.  He was so good that he led a no-name group of scrubs to the NBA finals.  How quickly we turn on our fallen idols...
It riles them to believe that you perceive the web they weave.  Keep on thinking free.
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jemagee

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2008, 04:45:22 PM »
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You don't have the history here...up until the Sixers traded Iverson, rick believed him to be the best SG in the league.  He was so good that he led a no-name group of scrubs to the NBA finals.  How quickly we turn on our fallen idols...

Ah, I see...they don't turn quickly on just the 'fallen' - but those who get big contracts are thrown under a bus for not being 5 times better since they make 5 times the money (see Iguodala, Andre)...the misunderstand of the nature of the NBA salary structure and what it costs to keep even above average players is fascinating to me :)

I miss Allen, but I don't think he'll ever win a championship (not because he's a defensive liability though but because of the uniqueness of his game and height requiring a very special kind of team needing to be build around him to win a title)...and already sixer fans have been suggesting the sixers make a run at getting him back - which i think is a bad idea.

I was down on the Mo Cheeks hiring from day one
I advocated trading Andre Miller before the 2007 draft to the hawks for some of their picks and youth
Hell i was pro dalembert for childress when it was floated years ago
Oh yeah - i hate sam dalembert with the white hot fury of an infinity amount of suns.

Offline WayOutWest

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2008, 04:52:02 PM »
Oh yeah - i hate sam dalembert with the white hot fury of an infinity amount of suns.

I've said he sucks from day one but nobody listens.  His "suckiness" jumped up 5X when he got paid 5X as much.
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jemagee

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #12 on: November 06, 2008, 04:55:14 PM »
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I've said he sucks from day one but nobody listens.  His "suckiness" jumped up 5X when he got paid 5X as much.

Oh - trust me - i feel your pain - my problem has always been that he's never learned the 'fundamentals' - first it was he picked up the game late - which always pissed me off as an excuse - but the sammyites (or sammites) always seemed to find ways to make it not sams fault that he can't dribble, catch, post up, count to 3, or produce one single decent post up move after playing pasketball for over half his life now.

Some day his contract will expire - and i'll be happy - in my heart of hearts i hope that speights can be as good as i hoped he could be for the sixers back in february and make sam a bench player before the end of 2008 season like thaddeus young did to the half-dimensional player that is reggie evans

Nothing like playing a team with only 4 offensive threats

I think 'shot blocking' could be the most over rated thing in basketball - the equivalent to the 'hold' or the 'quality start' (created by an agent to get mediocre pitchers more money....picked up by the mainstream media cause, well, they're morons as evidenced by gold glove voting year after year)

Offline rickortreat

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #13 on: November 06, 2008, 06:47:00 PM »
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No, just a defensive liability who has never won a championship.

He guards point guards - he plays shooting guard - i don't see why that's so complicated.

You say 'never won a championship' like it diminishes him as a player - he had crap support in philadelphia and still has neever had the right kind of PF to play with him (in my opinion) but might have him now - we'll see - i don't think so

You don't have the history here...up until the Sixers traded Iverson, rick believed him to be the best SG in the league.  He was so good that he led a no-name group of scrubs to the NBA finals.  How quickly we turn on our fallen idols...

He's STILL a great 2 guard, even manages 6 or 7 assists per game.  But he needs a big point guard to pair with and there aren't too many Magic Johnsons around.  It's complicated because point guards tend to be short, so if Iverson guards the one, the point has to play against the bigger player. Iverson cannot guard Kobe effectively (for example)

He might be a much better fit in Phila. now that they have Brand, but I wouldn't want him back at his salary.

As for Dalembert, he's an average Center but he still gives you 10 bds. and 10 pts. He's no more overpaid than a lot of NBA players, especially Centers.

jemagee

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Re: WHAT is wrong with the Sixers?
« Reply #14 on: November 06, 2008, 07:05:56 PM »
Andre Iguodala would make a fine point guard in my opinion

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As for Dalembert, he's an average Center but he still gives you 10 bds. and 10 pts. He's no more overpaid than a lot of NBA players, especially Centers.

Terrible way to judge a centers perfromance rick - i'd think someone so informed on absolutely everything would know that