Lakers dodge a bullet

[westkoast]

I completely, 100% disagree with you westkoast, and also Kenny Smith and Charles Barkley who said the same thing you did.  This is the kind of loss that sets you back psychologically.  This is the kind of 1 game loss that is much more than just a 1 game loss.  Grueling 7 game series, eek out an emotional 7th game on the road, sleep on the tarmac, old, tired, sleep deprived, exhausted, in Staples, playing well, huge lead, coasting through the game, victory within reach, almost there, SMACK!!!  YOU LOSE!!  Reggie Miller said it, you just can't give up games to great teams in the playoffs.  I would be very fearful of this series ending very quickly ala the Suns-Spurs in the 1st round were I a Spurs fan.

I like Kenny Smith so I am glad he agrees with me!  Although I think will have to agree to disagree.  While I think the loss stings and I saw Pop said the same thing I don't think this is the PHX Suns or the Denver Nuggets in the sense that this is a shotgun wound that they can't recover from.  I think they are down but not out. 

This is the defending champs, one of the best teams this decade, and one not known to let anything rattle them.  Although if you look back the last few times they've been rattled has been at the hands of the Los Angeles Lakers (.4 comes to mind).

To toot my own horn since Reality and Rick have been doing it..I've been pretty spot on with the Spurs this playoffs and I think I am spot on again here.

I completely, 100% disagree with you Laker Fan.  Gasol makes Kobe's passes look good, NOT the other way around.  I will GUARANTEE you that's Kwame Brown on the other end of those Kobe lobs, they ain't falling through the hoop.  The adjustment in the air through defensive traffic while maintaing the poise and touch to convert some of those lobs are INCREDIBLE by Gasol!!  I'll give credit to Kobe for trusting his teammates more and giving up the ball this year and I think its done wonders for his game.  But lets not pretend that Kobe makes Gasol's game, we're talking an All-Star calibre bonafide 20 point a game, franchise Power Forward here.  He's making it look pretty easy out there and its not.

This I agree with.  While Kobe's passes are on the money and they both have an excellent chemistry for only playing together for a short time, like you said if this is Kwame Brown most of these shots don't get converted.  People forget that Kobe use to set Kwame up nicely 3-4 times a game but he would blow 75% of his shots by either completely missing the rim, trying to lay it up, or by not even catching the pass.  Bynum was a big improvement over Kwame which is why he was scoring a lot of points off lobs and picks.  Gasol, IMO, is another step above that because he is more versatile then Bynum in that aspect.

I wouldn't down play what Kobe does in the two man game (and I know your not) just like you can't down play what Gasol does in the two man game.  They play with one another extremely well.  If Kobe didn't make him feel comfortable right off the bat I don't think you see them be as effective.  If Gasol wasn't so awesome with his foot work and using both hands I don't think you see them be as effective.

[WayOutWest]

I completely, 100% disagree with you Laker Fan.  Gasol makes Kobe's passes look good, NOT the other way around.  I will GUARANTEE you that's Kwame Brown on the other end of those Kobe lobs, they ain't falling through the hoop.  The adjustment in the air through defensive traffic while maintaing the poise and touch to convert some of those lobs are INCREDIBLE by Gasol!!  I'll give credit to Kobe for trusting his teammates more and giving up the ball this year and I think its done wonders for his game.  But lets not pretend that Kobe makes Gasol's game, we're talking an All-Star calibre bonafide 20 point a game, franchise Power Forward here.  He's making it look pretty easy out there and its not.

WRONG!  It's both of them.  Terrible example to use Kwame, Kwame would make Steve Nash look like a moron.  Kobe does the same thing with Bynum and Odom.  Kobe is a good passer, not great but good.  Both guys contribute to making that two man game look great.

[westkoast]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/chris_mannix/05/22/spurs.lakers/index.html?eref=T1

I am really annoyed with the Sports media honestly.  If he shoots too much "LA needs the passing Kobe who made plays like he did in the second round" if he doesn't shoot enough it's "LA needs the second half Kobe of Game 1 for the entire series"

NO!  They need Kobe.  Not just pour-in-a-lot-of-points Kobe.  Not just get-your-teammates-involved Kobe.  They just need Kobe to read and then decide what he wants to do.  His success this year as lied more into the fact that he is reading first and making decisions second.  Not just trying to attack, attack, attack.  You can't say "LA needs attacking Kobe" because his shot might not fall that night.  You can't say "LA needs passing Kobe" because there are times when the Lakers can't hit shots.  The game can change at any minute and the best player on a squad needs to be able to change as well.  You can't pigeon hole a star player in the playoffs.  Doesn't work like that.  If Kobe doesn't get people involved in the offense the Lakers defense struggles and when they do decide to double Kobe or force the ball out of his hands no one is ready to take shots. 

I guess my problem is there was no real analysis.  Just whining "oh he didn't drop 35 in the first half wahhhhhh"  by sports writers like the guy above.  Sports writers seem a little into themselves figuring that Kobe needs to put on a show so that they have an easier time writing an article the next day.  They want to be able to have a sensationalized story to write about instead of really doing quality analysis and then really showing their writing skills.  To me they just seem all around lazy and expect that Kobe needs to entertain them first rather then win a game.

[SPURSX3]

I completely, 100% disagree with you Laker Fan.  Gasol makes Kobe's passes look good, NOT the other way around.  I will GUARANTEE you that's Kwame Brown on the other end of those Kobe lobs, they ain't falling through the hoop.  The adjustment in the air through defensive traffic while maintaing the poise and touch to convert some of those lobs are INCREDIBLE by Gasol!!  I'll give credit to Kobe for trusting his teammates more and giving up the ball this year and I think its done wonders for his game.  But lets not pretend that Kobe makes Gasol's game, we're talking an All-Star calibre bonafide 20 point a game, franchise Power Forward here.  He's making it look pretty easy out there and its not.

WRONG!  It's both of them.  Terrible example to use Kwame, Kwame would make Steve Nash look like a moron.  Kobe does the same thing with Bynum and Odom.  Kobe is a good passer, not great but good.  Both guys contribute to making that two man game look great.

Well the passing looked good on both sides for the most part, the Spurs were passing pretty well for most of the game and then it seems the Lakers upped their passing when Kobe started surging.

[SPURSX3]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/chris_mannix/05/22/spurs.lakers/index.html?eref=T1

I am really annoyed with the Sports media honestly.  If he shoots too much "LA needs the passing Kobe who made plays like he did in the second round" if he doesn't shoot enough it's "LA needs the second half Kobe of Game 1 for the entire series"

NO!  They need Kobe.  Not just pour-in-a-lot-of-points Kobe.  Not just get-your-teammates-involved Kobe.  They just need Kobe to read and then decide what he wants to do.  His success this year as lied more into the fact that he is reading first and making decisions second.  Not just trying to attack, attack, attack.  You can't say "LA needs attacking Kobe" because his shot might not fall that night.  You can't say "LA needs passing Kobe" because there are times when the Lakers can't hit shots.  If Kobe doesn't get people involved on the offense the Lakers defense struggles and when they do decide to double Kobe or force the ball out of his hands no one is ready to take shots. 

I guess my problem is there was no real analysis, just whining, even though the Lakers won by sports writers like the guy above.

Oh Brother, Kobe WANTED to be the in the back ground?  Whatever, The Lakers only had four free throws for a while there and it was because the Spurs were on their game with the defense.  It was NOT because Kobe WANTED to pass the ball.  The Lakers were bad in the first hlf, why can't they just write that?  There was no switch last night, it's not like the Spurs cracked under the pressure, we lost, but I can't believe that we lost last night because Kobe 'decided' it was time to win. 

[westkoast]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/chris_mannix/05/22/spurs.lakers/index.html?eref=T1

I am really annoyed with the Sports media honestly.  If he shoots too much "LA needs the passing Kobe who made plays like he did in the second round" if he doesn't shoot enough it's "LA needs the second half Kobe of Game 1 for the entire series"

NO!  They need Kobe.  Not just pour-in-a-lot-of-points Kobe.  Not just get-your-teammates-involved Kobe.  They just need Kobe to read and then decide what he wants to do.  His success this year as lied more into the fact that he is reading first and making decisions second.  Not just trying to attack, attack, attack.  You can't say "LA needs attacking Kobe" because his shot might not fall that night.  You can't say "LA needs passing Kobe" because there are times when the Lakers can't hit shots.  If Kobe doesn't get people involved on the offense the Lakers defense struggles and when they do decide to double Kobe or force the ball out of his hands no one is ready to take shots. 

I guess my problem is there was no real analysis, just whining, even though the Lakers won by sports writers like the guy above.

Oh Brother, Kobe WANTED to be the in the back ground?  Whatever, The Lakers only had four free throws for a while there and it was because the Spurs were on their game with the defense.  It was NOT because Kobe WANTED to pass the ball.  The Lakers were bad in the first hlf, why can't they just write that?  There was no switch last night, it's not like the Spurs cracked under the pressure, we lost, but I can't believe that we lost last night because Kobe 'decided' it was time to win. 

Not only do I feel they are lazy but they short changed the Spurs defense. I agree with you X3..why couldn't they provide an analysis on the Spurs defense in the first half on Kobe?   They play tough defense with out fouling.  Bowen guards him better then anyone in the league not named Shane Battier.   I know Kobe can score at will but there are times when teams make it hard for him and he has to pass the ball.  THIS IS ONE OF THOSE TIMES!   It cracks me up that for so long they've complained about him not passing the ball and trying to force things.  He comes full circle, they applaud him for it, then turn around and chastise him for not shooting enough.  You guys voted him to be MVP for making everyone better.  You've never voted him MVP for his offensive displays before.  Which one is it?

This is the Spurs.  Not the Clippers.  You don't just "decide" to win against the Spurs.

[WayOutWest]

They play tough defense with out fouling.

I hope Skandypants watched that game so he can get an idea of how defense is done.  I think they mentioned the Spurs are one of the least fouling teams in the league where as the Jazz where the most.  For all the crying about the FT parade, the Lakers did not get to the line very often because of the Spurs defense.

IMO the Spurs just ran out of gas and they could not count on Manu to get them points outside of the normal offense.  When the Lakers started making things tough on TD in the post is when I expect Manu to make his biggest contribution.  Manu disappeared again and that was the difference maker for the Spurs last night.

[Skandery]

Terrible example to use Kwame, Kwame would make Steve Nash look like a moron.

Yes WOW, absolutely terrible example to use Kwame.  I have no earthly idea where I pulled that name from.

You don't just "decide" to win against the Spurs.

Not to be disrespectful to the champs and all but that's exactly what it looked like to me.  The Lakers just decided to win.  Kind of how the Spurs decided to win against the Suns in Game 1 of that series.  Sort of like in pick up basketball when one team is loaded and everyone on the court knows it but to everybody's surprise the underdogs are up 11-3 in the game to 16.  Then the better team hunkers down, plays for real, and ends up winning 16-15.  That's exactly what the game looked like to me.    

You can't lose sight of the fact that this is the Spurs we're talking about, they execute there way into that victory.  Shots not falling, Manu not playing well, momentum going the other way, what have you,  against any other team, they win that game, period.  Except they didn't!  To me that means they couldn't.  

I could be wrong, we'll see how the rest of the series plays out.

  

[SPURSX3]

Terrible example to use Kwame, Kwame would make Steve Nash look like a moron.

Yes WOW, absolutely terrible example to use Kwame.  I have no earthly idea where I pulled that name from.

You don't just "decide" to win against the Spurs.

Not to be disrespectful to the champs and all but that's exactly what it looked like to me.  The Lakers just decided to win.  Kind of how the Spurs decided to win against the Suns in Game 1 of that series.  Sort of like in pick up basketball when one team is loaded and everyone on the court knows it but to everybody's surprise the underdogs are up 11-3 in the game to 16.  Then the better team hunkers down, plays for real, and ends up winning 16-15.  That's exactly what the game looked like to me.    

You can't lose sight of the fact that this is the Spurs we're talking about, they execute there way into that victory.  Shots not falling, Manu not playing well, momentum going the other way, what have you,  against any other team, they win that game, period.  Except they didn't!  To me that means they couldn't.  

I could be wrong, we'll see how the rest of the series plays out.

  

Who ever said the Spurs 'decided' to win against the Suns.  They held their composure during that game, which credit goes to LA vets Kobe and Fish for that in yesterdays game, but they kept playing through Suns game and the difference I see is that the Suns had more energy in that game at the end, then we did in yesterdays game.  Could be the age factor, could be the rest factor, could be the Laker D at the end, could be all of it, but whatever the reason Tony and Tim just had nothing, and made nothing happen, IMO - and again this is no disrespect to the Laker defense, but It did not seem like Tim or Tony really got shut down, it looked like they just couldn't make their shots anymore.  I think they just started running out of gas in the third quarter.

[Skandery]

I think they mentioned the Spurs are one of the least fouling teams in the league where as the Jazz where the most.

Yes the Jazz foul, its what they do, they foul.  They'll foul you.  Jazz.  Foul.  Jazz.  Foul.  I think its so ingrained to the entire psyche of everyone, refs included, that it doesn't really matter whether the Jazz actually fouled you or not.  The Spurs, they don't foul.  No siree, just good, clean, hard-nosed, defense.  Spurs.  Don't foul.  Spurs.  Don't foul.  I predicted that the Jazz reputation would haunt them and its just what happened.    

Since EVERY team can be called for a foul on EVERY play, how much does reputation play into it, really.  I know I'm asking you to think like a grown-up, WOW.

Which guy has a shorter leash in a minor altercation Ron Artest or Steve Nash.  

[WayOutWest]

I think they mentioned the Spurs are one of the least fouling teams in the league where as the Jazz where the most.

Yes the Jazz foul, its what they do, they foul.  They'll foul you.  Jazz.  Foul.  Jazz.  Foul.  I think its so ingrained to the entire psyche of everyone, refs included, that it doesn't really matter whether the Jazz actually fouled you or not.  The Spurs, they don't foul.  No siree, just good, clean, hard-nosed, defense.  Spurs.  Don't foul.  Spurs.  Don't foul.  I predicted that the Jazz reputation would haunt them and its just what happened.    

Since EVERY team can be called for a foul on EVERY play, how much does reputation play into it, really.  I know I'm asking you to think like a grown-up, WOW.

Which guy has a shorter leash in a minor altercation Ron Artest or Steve Nash.  

Keep in mind Skandypanties that despite the Spurs defensive rep they do not create alot of turnovers nor do they get a lot of steals.  I don't know where the Jazz rank but to me that says the Spurs do play a brand of defense that is tailored to keeping constant pressure on another team rather than the home run shut them down type of D that would create a lot of contact and fouls.  The other thing is the Jazz just tried to out-physcial the Lakers and grabbed and pushed a lot more than most teams I've seen in the league, especially in the WC.

So lets put on our ciphering beenies and contemplate the brand of defense the Spurs ACTUALLY play vs the "rep" the Jazz have about their defense.

[Lurker]

Congrats, Laker fans.  Big win by your guys when it looked like they were going to fold up for a while.

IMO the Lakers stepped up their intensity when (as Doug Collins said about 100 billion times*) PJ put in Farmar & Sasha.  It energized the whole team and the Spurs seemed to hit the wall about the same time.  A couple different bounces or makes/misses and the game goes the other way.  Unfortuantely the Spurs couldn't steal home court back.

But then the real surprise was that Laker management forgot that the payoff to refs goes up each round.  I guess being sent home early the past few seasons caused them to gat lax.  But I would have thought that they would have been able to pass the collection plates through the stands and come up with the extra payola before halftime...not deep into the 3rd quarter.

* - did anyone else get tired of hearing Collins brown nose the Laker organization so deeply that you could only see the bottoms of his shoes?  He ranted on and on about how the Lakers came back from 20 down.  But absolutely no mention about how the Lakers fell 20 points behind on their homecourt after supposedly being the fresher, younger team.  I think Collins has moved ahead of Walton on my "hate to hear these guys talk" list.

[WayOutWest]

But then the real surprise was that Laker management forgot that the payoff to refs goes up each round.

I thought that the one call late in the game might have been the major discussion point.  The one where Odom or Gasol slapped the ball out of TD's hands and it went out of bounds under the Lakers basket but the Lakers got the ball back.  The very next play Gasol gets blocked at the rim and it looked like Manu not only fouled Gasol but also knocked the ball out of bounds.  The Spurs got the ball and I actually felt relief in what I thought was a "make up" call.  Not saying it was but it might have been.  There were obviously a few questionable calls but I was glad it was not the focal point of the game they way it was with the Lakers/Jazz.

The Lakers defense did pick up late in the 3rd but NOT enough to shut the Spurs down, IMO it was fatique and the Spurs bench was not up to the task of keeping a grip on the lead.  I think I heard a commentator say Pop used 11 of the 12 guys on the roster in the 1st half or maybe even the 1st quarter.  I think Manu will have solid games at home but the Spurs really need him to play well at least once on the road.  As a Lakers fan I would not feel to comfortable about this series until the Lakers win game 2.  I feel game 2 will be critical for the Lakers for various reason.

[SPURSX3]

But then the real surprise was that Laker management forgot that the payoff to refs goes up each round.

I thought that the one call late in the game might have been the major discussion point.  The one where Odom or Gasol slapped the ball out of TD's hands and it went out of bounds under the Lakers basket but the Lakers got the ball back.  The very next play Gasol gets blocked at the rim and it looked like Manu not only fouled Gasol but also knocked the ball out of bounds.  The Spurs got the ball and I actually felt relief in what I thought was a "make up" call.  Not saying it was but it might have been.  There were obviously a few questionable calls but I was glad it was not the focal point of the game they way it was with the Lakers/Jazz.

The Lakers defense did pick up late in the 3rd but NOT enough to shut the Spurs down, IMO it was fatique and the Spurs bench was not up to the task of keeping a grip on the lead.  I think I heard a commentator say Pop used 11 of the 12 guys on the roster in the 1st half or maybe even the 1st quarter.  I think Manu will have solid games at home but the Spurs really need him to play well at least once on the road.  As a Lakers fan I would not feel to comfortable about this series until the Lakers win game 2.  I feel game 2 will be critical for the Lakers for various reason.

I am pretty sure that was a make up call, that's why I didn't bother to bring it up.   

[Lurker]

I thought that the one call late in the game might have been the major discussion point.  The one where Odom or Gasol slapped the ball out of TD's hands and it went out of bounds under the Lakers basket but the Lakers got the ball back.  The very next play Gasol gets blocked at the rim and it looked like Manu not only fouled Gasol but also knocked the ball out of bounds.  The Spurs got the ball and I actually felt relief in what I thought was a "make up" call.  Not saying it was but it might have been.  There were obviously a few questionable calls but I was glad it was not the focal point of the game they way it was with the Lakers/Jazz.

If not for the makeup call it might have been.    

When they showed the replay...everyone not named Doug Collins...saw Gasol/Odom grab or chop Duncan's upper arm.  It should have been a foul with Duncan going to the line.  And with under 2 minutes in a close game it could have been a game decider especially if the Lakers would have scored (a potential 4 point swing).  But then the Spurs got the ball back although the replays show that it went off of a diving Manu.  And of course Collins had to chime in with "the Spurs got a break".