Tony Parker, top 3 point guard?

[Reality]

10/10 on the weak scale.  4 defenders are not collapsing on Duncan.  But they are in position to rebound as all 4 Spurs are near the perimeter in 4 Dumb.  I would not have Tony be one of the ones going for the O rebound, altho he certainly got a few when Duncan was high post.

Duncan does not convert 50% every game, no where close.  Open your eyes up.  Near triple double in open flow O as the Spurs easily got 103 pts and you're bitching.  Yet you want the same play ran 500000000 times.

If you didn't see the difference between Spurs O in Gm 2 and opening of Gm 3 with NO changes in Cavs D you're blind.  No amount of self adjulizing is going to change that.

[rickortreat]

Reality:

Duncan does actually produce on about 50% of his touches.  He either gets a score or draws a foul, or passes back out of the post- with no loss of possession, about half the time he the posts up.  And many times when he passes out of the post it results in a score or a shot and a recovery by the Spurs!

This is what makes the Spurs so difficult to stop, even when TD is slightly below average in the playoffs.  He is so automatic, and so difficult to stop that the Spurs can continue to post him up and run plays off his posting up, and have a better than average chance of success. 

Futher, the mere threat of TD in the post is what opens up all those outside shots for Finley, Horry, etc.  And, to a certain extent is a limiting factor in Parker's assist totals.
 

[Reality]

Reality:

Duncan does actually produce on about 50% of his touches.  He either gets a score or draws a foul, or passes back out of the post- with no loss of possession, about half the time he the posts up.  And many times when he passes out of the post it results in a score or a shot and a recovery by the Spurs!

This is what makes the Spurs so difficult to stop, even when TD is slightly below average in the playoffs.  He is so automatic, and so difficult to stop that the Spurs can continue to post him up and run plays off his posting up, and have a better than average chance of success. 

Futher, the mere threat of TD in the post is what opens up all those outside shots for Finley, Horry, etc.  And, to a certain extent is a limiting factor in Parker's assist totals.

I know he averages 50%.  My point is the Spurs have two distinctly different modes when they pass in to TD.  One is where Parker or whomever feeds him cuts thru and around.  Other players also shift, perhaps one or two of them will spot up at the trey arc.  That is 4 Down, and yes he not only shoots 50% but really more like 55 or even 60%. 
The other is 4 Dumb.  This is where Duncan is fed and all 4 other Spurs go and stand around the arc.  Duncan holds the ball for 3-8 seconds or dribbles 8 times.  Often times he is stripped or puts up a shot that is not even close.  In 4 Dumb he shoots about 33% or worse.

[WayOutWest]

The other is 4 Dumb.  This is where Duncan is fed and all 4 other Spurs go and stand around the arc.  Duncan holds the ball for 3-8 seconds or dribbles 8 times.  Often times he is stripped or puts up a shot that is not even close.  In 4 Dumb he shoots about 33% or worse.

I'm sure Reality has stats to back up the 33%, he didn't just pull that number out of his .....

[westkoast]

Reality:

Duncan does actually produce on about 50% of his touches.  He either gets a score or draws a foul, or passes back out of the post- with no loss of possession, about half the time he the posts up.  And many times when he passes out of the post it results in a score or a shot and a recovery by the Spurs!

This is what makes the Spurs so difficult to stop, even when TD is slightly below average in the playoffs.  He is so automatic, and so difficult to stop that the Spurs can continue to post him up and run plays off his posting up, and have a better than average chance of success. 

Futher, the mere threat of TD in the post is what opens up all those outside shots for Finley, Horry, etc.  And, to a certain extent is a limiting factor in Parker's assist totals.

I know he averages 50%.  My point is the Spurs have two distinctly different modes when they pass in to TD.  One is where Parker or whomever feeds him cuts thru and around.  Other players also shift, perhaps one or two of them will spot up at the trey arc.  That is 4 Down, and yes he not only shoots 50% but really more like 55 or even 60%. 
The other is 4 Dumb.  This is where Duncan is fed and all 4 other Spurs go and stand around the arc.  Duncan holds the ball for 3-8 seconds or dribbles 8 times.  Often times he is stripped or puts up a shot that is not even close.  In 4 Dumb he shoots about 33% or worse.

Here is a stat you forgot to leave out...

When the Spurs play 4 dumb they win the title 60% of the time in the last 5 years.

I am such a better Spurs fan then you are and I don't like em nearly as much as you pretend to.

[Reality]

When the Spurs play 4 dumb they win the title 60% of the time in the last 5 years. 

When the Spurs play 4 Dumb too much they lose the title every year.  Another regular coffee.
Also, Parker the point guard stats flourish in open flow O.  Even in the loss years, ie when he dropped 30 on the Lakers for a 2-0 2004 lead.  Que Krishna response.

[WayOutWest]

Also, Parker the point guard stats flourish in open flow O.  Even in the loss years, ie when he dropped 30 on the Lakers for a 2-0 2004 lead.

Yea we all know how well the open flow O ended in 2004.

[Reality]

Also, Parker the point guard stats flourish in open flow O.  Even in the loss years, ie when he dropped 30 on the Lakers for a 2-0 2004 lead.

Yea we all know how well the open flow O ended in 2004.

We do.  Spurs up 2-0.   Now can you and westkoast get a room and keep this thread on topic?  Well, at least go 50% and get a room?  I'm out.