Looks like Blazers are finally moving Rasheed

[Lurker]

What facts am I not realizing?  The fact that the Spurs thought that Jackson was a mere afterthought?  The fact that they wanted him to take peon money when he was worth more?  Which of those facts aren't true?

 

All of those facts are not true.  If he was so valuable then why didn't some other team offer him more money.  The Spurs offered him the money up front...more than any other team.  And his agent rejected it convincing Jackson he was worth more.  I guess the marketplace showed who was right in that matter.

So the facts:

1) Jackson wasn't an "afterthought"....he turned down the Spurs FROM THE BEGINNING.

2) Spurs offered more than 28 other teams....so offered more than market value.  By definition that must be more than "peon money".

[Guest_Reality]

gaither wrote <Why on earth would he have stayed in San Antonio where he was likely to be the third in line at the PG spot if the Spurs landed Kidd?

Because its better to play 15-20 minutes a game and start and possibly continue to start (Parker season opening injury) on a world champ then to play fulltime on a loser Pacific Patsy Division team.

It is It is It is.

Spurs offered Speedy same money as GS.  I think.  In fact it was Speedy who had a late change of heart and offered to stay if they would offer him the same.  Then the next thing you knew the trade was done.  I gotta read those archives that spurs101 posted.

[WayOutWest]

gaither wrote <Why on earth would he have stayed in San Antonio where he was likely to be the third in line at the PG spot if the Spurs landed Kidd?

Because its better to play 15-20 minutes a game and start and possibly continue to start (Parker season opening injury) on a world champ then to play fulltime on a loser Pacific Patsy Division team.

It is It is It is.

Spurs offered Speedy same money as GS.  I think.  In fact it was Speedy who had a late change of heart and offered to stay if they would offer him the same.  Then the next thing you knew the trade was done.  I gotta read those archives that spurs101 posted.

A THIRD string PG getting 15-20, yea right!

Speedy wanted more playing time, he thought he was going the be the started at GS, why wouldn't he leave?  You keep thinking playing for the Spurs is some type of honor that overshadows ridding the pine or getting less money.  Not so.

At the time Speedy made the right choice, the NVE trade was not even on the horizon at that point.  NVE has been injured most of the season and complaining about leaving the rest of the season, so Speedy is still looking like he made the right decision.

[spursfan101]

Only if you think giving up another championship ring in 2004 is a good choice.    

[WayOutWest]

We're talking about Speedy not Mark Madsen you big dummy!  :rolleyes:  

[Randy]

What facts am I not realizing?  The fact that the Spurs thought that Jackson was a mere afterthought?  The fact that they wanted him to take peon money when he was worth more?  Which of those facts aren't true?

 

All of those facts are not true.  If he was so valuable then why didn't some other team offer him more money.  The Spurs offered him the money up front...more than any other team.  And his agent rejected it convincing Jackson he was worth more.  I guess the marketplace showed who was right in that matter.

So the facts:

1) Jackson wasn't an "afterthought"....he turned down the Spurs FROM THE BEGINNING.

2) Spurs offered more than 28 other teams....so offered more than market value.  By definition that must be more than "peon money".

I think Jackson is better than $3.3 mill a year -- you don't?  Jackson was as important as to the Spurs success last year as any of your role players -- Bowen, Parker (actually a lot more than Parker), Speedy, etc.  You think they will throw $3 mill a year at Parker when his contract comes up?  

I think there was a LOT more in this factor than Jackson not being worth more on the open market -- players simply aren't going to get as much in the luxury world and I think teams weren't much in the market for a SG so late in the season.  It's obvious that Jackson wasn't happy with the Spurs or else he would have gone back to them for what he is currently playing for (and he is a lot better player than Mercer as at least as good as Turk, IMO) with the Hawks, don't you think?

[gaither]

Reality, I said third in line...behind Kidd, behind Parker. You tell me how many minutes that would have given Speedy?! What's so enticing about that prospect? Some people actually want to earn their rings, not get them for sitting on the bench for 90% of the time  <_<

Speedy might have stayed if he knew he would be second in line at the point, behind Parker. But everyone in the Spurs organization thought Kidd was going to be joining them in San Antonio.  

[Lurker]

No Jackson isn't worth more than $3.3 mil if no one wants to pay him that much.  He ended up signing with the Hawks for the lower exemption...something the Spurs didn't have because they were below the cap last summer.  Once he told the Spurs no, Pop made other arrangements and filled up the roster.  To return to the Spurs Jackson would have had to take the vet's minimum....not much for a 3 year veteran (definatley less than he got from the Hawks).

Stated simply:  Jackson (and his agent) screwed up.  The Spurs didn't diss him.

[Randy]

Umm, based on your assumption, you would be saying that players are worth what they are offered -- and that simply isn't true.  Big men will ALWAYS get paid more than they are worth and most teams are simply not going to pay any more than they have to.  I don't disagree that Jackson's agent gave him bad advice -- I do disagree that Jackson isn't worth more than $3.3 a year.  You want to tell me Mercer is worth what he is making?  :lol:  

[Lurker]

You want to tell me Mercer is worth what he is making?

Obviously some GM at some point in time thought so.  But then what has that got to do with Jackson?

Or how about...is Fisher & Fox worth what they are making?

[Randy]

It goes a great deal to prove that players aren't always making what they are worth -- Jackson is worth more than he is currently making and he is worth more than the $3.3 he was offered by the Spurs.  You're comments about the fact that if nobody paid him more than $3.3, then he isn't worth $3.3.  That's simply not true -- there are players who get paid less than they are worth and some who get paid more than they are worth (see Allan Houston, for example).

I don't think Fisher is worth his current salary, mainly due to the health of his feet.  Fox is worth the money, I believe, when he gets back into playing shape.  We will need him for the finals.

[spursfan101]

The truth about Steven Jackson.

He was a nobody until he came to the Spurs. He was a hothead, and as you know, hotheads don't figure into Pop's scheme. Nevertheless, Spurs assistant coach Mike Brown worked him a great deal, taught him to control his temper (no, I'm not talking about the Hulk), and he became an integral part of the Spurs championship run last season.  

Keep in mind that Jackson shared the bulk of his minutes with an up and coming Manu Ginobli.  Ginobli is heading into his free agent year this year, Pop needed to utilize him as much as possible, or fear Manu bolting to another team.

I think he set Steven Jackson up.  After the season, Jack told Pop that he deserved his "payday" so Pop kept him on the backburners while he tried to sign JKidd.  Only when the bulk of the Spurs players had been signed, did Pop offer Jack a $3 mill contract (in my opinion, all the while knowing he would reject it.)  When he did reject it, Pop was able to let him go without much of a fuss.  Manu has gladly filled his role.

Pop was tired of having a hothead on the sideline, it was time for him to go. Did the Spurs throw a burn?  Yes, in the sense that they made him wait so long. By the time the Spurs let him go, he wasn't high on everybodies list. Not to mention the NBA is like a small catholic school. Everybody knows everything, and people talk.  Word of Jack's not so level headedness spread.  Most coaches didn't want to take a chance, and throw him big bucks.

Those are my thoughts.  Manu is THAT GOOD, he will only get better, I think Pop made the right choice.

[kenneth]

Good to see tha Blazers getting that long over do enema. After Ruben is flushed out it will be time to wipe and start over.

Hows it going Ziggy...

[ziggy]

Kenneth,
I wondered what happened to you after MSNBC shut down.  Glad to see you made it here.  You made the MSNBC board a lot of fun.  Let me offer an official welcome.
Things are going fine.  I have a baby girl (at least we think it's a girl) due in about 2 weeks.  Loved the trades the Blazers have made, glad to see Whitless go bye bye.  BTW my sainthood is still being debated by the Pope, but I am still hopeful.

How about you.  I trust all is well with you?

[kenneth]

Kenneth,
I wondered what happened to you after MSNBC shut down.  Glad to see you made it here.  You made the MSNBC board a lot of fun.  Let me offer an official welcome.
Things are going fine.  I have a baby girl (at least we think it's a girl) due in about 2 weeks.  Loved the trades the Blazers have made, glad to see Whitless go bye bye.  BTW my sainthood is still being debated by the Pope, but I am still hopeful.

How about you.  I trust all is well with you?

Thanks for the welcome. Congrats of the baby girl. I had three girls!!!!! yes God does have a sense of humor.  Seriously I wouldn't trade them for a boy for anything.  People always said "don't you want a boy?" the answer was always an easy NO!  

It was a great trade for Portland.  Rasheed is better then either Theo or Reef.  But he was just a problem......like Bonzi and McInnis.  Miles was a good pick up also. I actually felt bad for Cheeks when he broke down.

I wonder whos next to go? Davis?