The marketing of Kobe

[JoMal]

The fact is, that was his apartment, or at least he was paying rent on it.  The police report doesn't mention that, because no one told the police that it was AI's.  There were no charges filled against Iverson by the people in the apartment.

I don't excuse AI's failings at all, but it's easier to accept abberant behavior in someone who comes from his background than it is someone like Kobe.

I think I am beginning to see what westkoast is talking about regarding a free pass on Iverson. If you really believe this, rick, it is fans like you who are causing the problem in the first place.

Iverson broke into an apartment that he was not living in, but apparently had renters living in. This is like a landlord using his pass key to walk into the apartment of his female renter while she is in the shower. It is totally illegal and the police not mentioning it probably had something to do with the simple fact that it was irrelevant to the breaking and entering crime committed. That the renters did not press charges against Iverson might have something to do with the very likely fact they could not rock the boat on losing a undoubtedly nicer apartment then they might be able to have otherwise.

And the part where, since Iverson comes from a poor background he should get more free passes then someone like Kobe, who does not? You have GOT to be kidding on that one.

Once Iverson accepts the money he is getting, he no longer BELONGS to that other world any longer. He can't. And this incident clearly shows why. It is up to him to figure that out for himself.

And frankly, there are few places in this "culture" that favors gansters breaking into apartments branishing a gun. That is called home invasion and I think they arrest people in Iverson's old neighborhood regularly for it, even though you "think" it is okay for Iverson to get away with it, since it is so acceptible for his "culture" to do it.

[Reality]

Iverson broke into an apartment that he was not living in, but apparently had renters living in. This is like a landlord using his pass key to walk into the apartment of his female renter while she is in the shower.

My recollection is that Iverson paid for the apt.  The people living in it were living in it for FREE, at A.I. expense.  Hardly a landlord/tennat relationship.  dabods, rt?

That you are paying someones apt does not give you the right to barge in, but it's hardly in the same ballpark as landlord/tennant.

Give someone a free house or apt and they may tolerate your barging in once every 6 months or so.  No guns tho please.

Was this apt in the 'hood?  If so, different customs for different places.  Just as one visiting Kobmes house would be expected to make an appointment so the butler, nurse, child psychologist, Media Spinner, cook, and Kobes diaper changer could be notified in advance, perhaps this neighborhood of AIs apt dwellers has its own customs.

[westkoast]

Iverson broke into an apartment that he was not living in, but apparently had renters living in. This is like a landlord using his pass key to walk into the apartment of his female renter while she is in the shower.

My recollection is that Iverson paid for the apt.  The people living in it were living in it for FREE, at A.I. expense.  Hardly a landlord/tennat relationship.  dabods, rt?

That you are paying someones apt does not give you the right to barge in, but it's hardly in the same ballpark as landlord/tennant.

Give someone a free house or apt and they may tolerate your barging in once every 6 months or so.  No guns tho please.

Was this apt in the 'hood?  If so, different customs for different places.  Just as one visiting Kobmes house would be expected to make an appointment so the butler, nurse, child psychologist, Media Spinner, cook, and Kobes diaper changer could be notified in advance, perhaps this neighborhood of AIs apt dwellers has its own customs.

LOL

You are missing the point.  Whether he paid rent on his "friends" house or not is beside the point as he barged in  and threatend him with a gun in his waist.  Forget the question of why he is paying rent for his hood buddies in Philly.

Like I said, I do not have a problem with AI keeping it 'hood' but don't give him a golden pass if you are going to look down on others about it.

And if you are assuming I am saying this to protect Kobe's image, gimmie a break...the guy forces himself on young women so how exactly is pointing this out going to make him look less than an alleged rapist and an adulterer?

[Derek Bodner]

Yes, it was AI's apartment, he was paying for it, and I believe his name was on it.  He wasn't renting it out.

It would more be like my dad paying for my rent and barging in one day.  A little inconsiderate?  Sure.  Not illegal.

And, for the gun, the guy never claimed he brandished it, and nobody else mentioned the presence of a gun that night besides the guy who dropped the case when he couldn't settle out of court.

Just like Kobe, none of us really know what happened that night.  I think it's highly likely that Iverson's accusor was looking for a monetary reward, just like Kobe's accusor did.

[westkoast]

Yes, it was AI's apartment, he was paying for it, and I believe his name was on it.  He wasn't renting it out.

It would more be like my dad paying for my rent and barging in one day.  A little inconsiderate?  Sure.  Not illegal.

And, for the gun, the guy never claimed he brandished it, and nobody else mentioned the presence of a gun that night besides the guy who dropped the case when he couldn't settle out of court.

Just like Kobe, none of us really know what happened that night.  I think it's highly likely that Iverson's accusor was looking for a monetary reward, just like Kobe's accusor did.

You are right, we dont know exactly what happend and the element of guys he hangs out with its VERY possible they wanted to pull change out of his pocket.  Do I think Allen Iverson is the devil because of it? No not at all.  I am simply bringing this up to point out the pass he is given for his actions.

Rick, I understand AI comes from the gutter but that still does not mean he should get a pass for wielding a gun like a street thug if other players are not going to get the same pass.  I believe Damon Stoudamire came from a shady area also but I am not going to excuse him getting busted with 3 pounds of weed because of it.  As for Kobe, you can be poor or rich and should know when a woman says stop it means stop.  If Kobe was poor would it have been less offensive?  Hell no.  

[Reality]

And, for the gun, the guy never claimed he brandished it, and nobody else mentioned the presence of a gun that night besides the guy who dropped the case when he couldn't settle out of court.

Just like Kobe, none of us really know what happened that night.  I think it's highly likely that Iverson's accusor was looking for a monetary reward, just like Kobe's accusor did.

Rick, I understand AI comes from the gutter but that still does not mean he should get a pass for wielding a gun like a street thug if other players are not going to get the same pass. ....

And, for the gun, the guy never claimed he brandished it, and nobody else mentioned the presence of a gun that night besides the guy who dropped the case when he couldn't settle out of court.

[westkoast]

And, for the gun, the guy never claimed he brandished it, and nobody else mentioned the presence of a gun that night besides the guy who dropped the case when he couldn't settle out of court.

Just like Kobe, none of us really know what happened that night.  I think it's highly likely that Iverson's accusor was looking for a monetary reward, just like Kobe's accusor did.

Rick, I understand AI comes from the gutter but that still does not mean he should get a pass for wielding a gun like a street thug if other players are not going to get the same pass. ....

And, for the gun, the guy never claimed he brandished it, and nobody else mentioned the presence of a gun that night besides the guy who dropped the case when he couldn't settle out of court.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/alleniversonmug2.html

Gregory (AIs buddy who went with him) said "If you do know something and are not telling us then we will be back for you" While this was occuring Allen Iverson was in the backroom with Charles Jones and was lifting up his shirt showing a black handgun

Read the police report yourself.

[Derek Bodner]

While this was occuring Allen Iverson was in the backroom with Charles Jones and was lifting up his shirt showing a black handgun

Yes, and the testimony that AI lifted up his shirt showing a gun was given to the police by Charles Jones and Hakim Carey, both of whom dropped the case after not settling out of court, which brings us back to the original statement.

Had they been able to prove it, neither the DA nor the complainants would have dropped the case.  It turned into a he-said she-said argument in which case the credibility and the motives of the complainants were in question.

[JoMal]

Yes, it was AI's apartment, he was paying for it, and I believe his name was on it.  He wasn't renting it out.

It would more be like my dad paying for my rent and barging in one day.  A little inconsiderate?  Sure.  Not illegal.

 

Were the squatters in the apartment family? If so, then your comparison makes sense. If they were friends of his (or his wifes) from the 'hood, then we are talking about an invasion of pressumed privacy.

Even if you have a friend staying at your house, you just do not go into their room without permission.

And, for the gun, the guy never claimed he brandished it, and nobody else mentioned the presence of a gun that night besides the guy who dropped the case when he couldn't settle out of court.

Just like Kobe, none of us really know what happened that night.  I think it's highly likely that Iverson's accusor was looking for a monetary reward, just like Kobe's accusor did.

Gee, do you think. Who was it that mentioned that once Iverson accepted the money, his past life had to BECOME his past life, because incidents just like this one are bound to happen otherwise.

Oh, yeah. It was me.

[Derek Bodner]

Were the squatters in the apartment family?

I actually believe one of the tennants was Iversons cousin (Shaun Bowman), who was sharing the apartment with Charles Jones, who was there with his 17 year old boyfriend/lover Hakim Carey.

So yes, AI did have relatives in the apartment.

[Reality]

Read the police report yourself.

As posted by dabods:  Yes, and the testimony that AI lifted up his shirt showing a gun was given to the police by Charles Jones and Hakim Carey, both of whom dropped the case after not settling out of court, which brings us back to the original statement.
Had they been able to prove it, neither the DA nor the complainants would have dropped the case.

How about you reading this one:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/nicholson1.html

[westkoast]

Read the police report yourself.

As posted by dabods:  Yes, and the testimony that AI lifted up his shirt showing a gun was given to the police by Charles Jones and Hakim Carey, both of whom dropped the case after not settling out of court, which brings us back to the original statement.
Had they been able to prove it, neither the DA nor the complainants would have dropped the case.

How about you reading this one:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/nicholson1.html

Hmm lets see....These guys are living off Allen Iverson, he knows some not so nice people in town, charges dropped.  Even you can get to the point that the charges were dropped for a reason other than everything was made up.  Just like even tho the charges were dropped on Kobe that doesn't mean he did  stop what he was doing when asked.  Pretty simple right?  We all know Kobe got a little to hot and heavy with the girl, just cuz it was dropped doesn't mean that he did not go overboard with that young girl.

As for Jack Nicholas?  I care because..... This is a thread about basketball players and their image.  Not about what some actor does with a hooker.  Am I suppose to care because hes a Laker fan :laugh:

[Reality]

[/URL]

Hmm lets see....These guys are living off Allen Iverson, he knows some not so nice people in town, charges dropped.  Even you can get to the point that the charges were dropped for a reason other than everything was made up.  Just like even tho the charges were dropped on Kobe that doesn't mean he did  stop what he was doing when asked.  Pretty simple right?  We all know Kobe got a little to hot and heavy with the girl, just cuz it was dropped doesn't mean that he did not go overboard with that young girl.

As for Jack Nicholas?  I care because..... This is a thread about basketball players and their image.  Not about what some actor does with a hooker.  Am I suppose to care because hes a Laker fan :laugh: [/quote]
 No doubt it's possible all of these honest, forthright citizens could be holding back on some truthful facts. B)  

As to Jack Nicholson being just "a Laker fan." :eek2:  :eek2:

Emergency Council at The Laker House called to session ASAP.  Westkoast has now exhibited mulitiple incidents of balance and reasoning.

"Some People Change" :cry:  :cry:     Kenny Chesney

[rickortreat]

I think I am beginning to see what westkoast is talking about regarding a free pass on Iverson. If you really believe this, rick, it is fans like you who are causing the problem in the first place.

Iverson broke into an apartment that he was not living in, but apparently had renters living in. This is like a landlord using his pass key to walk into the apartment of his female renter while she is in the shower. It is totally illegal and the police not mentioning it probably had something to do with the simple fact that it was irrelevant to the breaking and entering crime committed. That the renters did not press charges against Iverson might have something to do with the very likely fact they could not rock the boat on losing a undoubtedly nicer apartment then they might be able to have otherwise.

And the part where, since Iverson comes from a poor background he should get more free passes then someone like Kobe, who does not? You have GOT to be kidding on that one.

No, I'm not kidding about understanding people's limitations as related to background.  This does not mean that AI is a good person by any means, I do think he's trying, but I really don't know the guy.

But right and wrong, proper behavioural conduct, these things are learned behavior.  Few people from the ghetto ever get the ghetto out of them.  This doens't give them a free pass.  If Iverson got convicted for brandishing that gun, I would have had no problem with it.  The story and the way that he got off does smell.

But Kobe is from a nice upper class neighborhood, pretty simillar to the one I grew up in (His is nicer and wealthier by far)  I am making an assumption here, but Kobe growing up there would have a much more simillar outlook on right and wrong and proper conduct to me than AI would.

I would never impose myself on another person sexually.  That is so obviously wrong that there's no point in even discussing it.  So too is pulling a gun out to scare people into doing what you want.  Frankly neither of these guys could be accused of exemplary conduct on all occaissions.  

But in comparison between Kobe and AI, I have more of a problem with Kobe because I think he knows better.  Whereas AI, growing up where he did and with the people he did, make his behaviour more understandible, but definitely not acceptable.

 

 

[Derek Bodner]

Hmm lets see....These guys are living off Allen Iverson, he knows some not so nice people in town, charges dropped. Even you can get to the point that the charges were dropped for a reason other than everything was made up.

Or...

AI comes charging in at 2 am.  Charles Jones doesn't 911 until 11 hours later.  If someone was in a panic for their life, wouldn't they call the police immediately?  Could it be that upon reflecting that AI was in his house and that he was upset that his wife had run away, he realized he could make a few bucks off of the ordeal?

Like I said, none of us really know.  And I never said AI was the saint.  On the contrary, you're the one making definitive statements about the quality of person he is.