Payton to the Heat all but official??

[westkoast]

As if the Miami Heat wasn't already loaded with recognizable, veteran names, the team is about to add one more.

To fill a void at point guard, the Heat will sign 15-year veteran Gary Payton to a one-year contract today, according to his agent, Aaron Goodwin.

Payton flew into Miami late Wednesday and will take a physical and sign the minimum $1.1 million deal today. For the second time in his career, Payton will join a Shaquille O'Neal-led team in hopes of winning his first title. The previous time the two joined forces was in the 2003-04 season with the Lakers, when Los Angeles lost to the Pistons in five games in the NBA Finals.

Payton will join a similar team in Miami, with Dwyane Wade, Jason Williams and Payton's former Celtics teammate Antoine Walker also in place for a title run.

A TOP DEFENDER

For his career, Payton has averaged 17.6 points, 7.2 assists, 4.1 rebounds and is a one-time winner of the Defensive Player of the Year award. Payton, 37, is not the same player he was in is prime, his numbers dropping significantly in his past few seasons while playing for the Sonics, Bucks, Lakers and Celtics.

But as a backup on an already loaded team, Payton is the type of defensive-minded veteran Heat president Pat Riley values.

The Heat has tried to fill the backup point guard role for several weeks, considering the likes of Damon Jones and Steve Blake. But with less than two weeks left until the start of training camp, the team was able to sign the biggest free agent name remaining among point guards.

Goodwin said Payton initially wanted to stay on the West Coast and considered signing with Phoenix. But after a conversation with O'Neal, and another talk with Riley last weekend in Las Vegas, Payton focused his efforts on joining the Heat.

Goodwin added that Payton has no problem coming off the bench, with Williams expected to be the starter.

''Gary's OK with it,'' Goodwin said. ``But all he wants to do is be in a situation where his team is competitive and tries to win.''

ROOM FOR MORE

By not using any of its $5 million midlevel exception, the Heat leaves itself in position to add a player during the season who might be released.

Several such situations have occurred during the past few seasons, with Shandon Anderson, Alonzo Mourning and Payton among the players who have been in such situations.

The Heat still will likely sign another wing player before heading into camp, with former first-round pick Rodney White an option.

Payton's signing gives the team 16 players under contract, one above the maximum allowed once the season begins.

[westkoast]

Pretty much official...all but the press confrence announcing it.  Good move or bad move guys?  What do you think?

Personally I think its a good pick up.  Payton cant play heavy minutes but with the amount of guards they have he wouldn't need to.  Even at his age his defense is twice as good as JWill's  

The only negative I see to adding Payton is that he has the 'I do what I want' personality.  He's similar to Walker in that way.

[rickortreat]

IMO, Gary's pretty much done as a player.  Doesn't have the quickness anymore, isn't the greatest teamate to have either.  But since Shaq recruited him, it is a nice gesture to try and help him get a ring.

Miami is really stacking the deck in their favor.  But it still comes down to Wade and Shaq.  If either of them gets hurt, they'll be hard-pressed to get anywhere.  There's no one else on the team that can make up for the loss of either of them.

And, have they really solved their ball distribution problem?  Do they have a guard smart enough to make sure the ball gets into Shaq's hands at the end of the game?

[Reality]

Bottom line I don't have a yes or no answer other then to say at this point it's a reasonable risk at the price is how Miami views it.  It does seem Shaq inspired, altho Shaq was said to have wanted Damon Jones and i don't see a huge price difference to justify shipping Damon and bringing in Payton.

Surely it will be in a reduced role.  Have to wait and see how he does.  Could it be that Shaq was happy with Paytons performance in the 2004 Playoffs?  After getting torched by Tony Parker in the 1st two games it was Pouton who spoke up against Phil Winters triangle and said you've got to let me pick n role against the smaller Parker.  Phil acquiesced and indeed Payton was much more effective.  Payton also on board with the "get it to Shaq" strategy as opposed to Kobme throwing up shots v Pistons.

Did Shaq also not get along with Eddie Jones thus his exit from LaLa?

Rick Buecher from espn thinks Riley is on a major ego trip to make sure if the Heat title it will be his name in lights just as much as Shraq, thus all the moves.

[Skandery]

On the subject of Gary Payton, it took 5 pages to break it down to Joe about how Payton is no longer an elite PG in this league.  And perhaps after Payton toiled in the unsigned pool for most of the free agent period (and lets not forget the humorous jab from Ziggy) he begins to understand what I was talking about.  You know I gotta give you crap about that bud...

In all seriousness I do think this is a good pick-up for Miami because of the role they expect Gary to play.  Not the 40-42 minutes he's been used to for his career, but as a veteran backup that can perhaps calm Jason Williams down a bit, or at the very least challenge him enough to keep him in line.  He's worked with Shaq before and Gary still remains a clever playmaker at times.  I hope he does well...

With all that being said though, I don't see Gary filling the particular niche Damon Jones successfully fulfilled.  Payton has never been a consistent shooter from beyond the arc.  Whether Miami can get that same outside consistency from Williams without the requisite hindrance to chemistry remains to be seen because they ain't getting it from Gary.  I think before all is said and done, Miami will regret not having re-signed Damon....last minute of Game 7 ECF notwithstanding.      

[Guest_Randy]

I think this WAS a good pickup for Miami.  It gives them some very good insurance rather than putting all of their eggs in Williams basket at PG (although I wouldn't mind seeing Wade spend some time at the PG position).  

GP is certainly no longer the defensive stalwart he once was but he played better in Boston last year than he played in LA the previous year.  GP just didn't fit into the triangle (which basically made him a spot up shooter -- DEFINATELY not GP's game).  However, I think GP would be a very good player for Miami -- esp. when Wade needs a blow.  

On a side note, I agree with Skander  :eek3: Miami is DEFINATELY going to miss Damon Jones on the arch (although Posey is a pretty good 3 point shooter).  I'm still a little clueless on why Damon left and why Miami didn't push harder to keep him.

[Skandery]

However, I think GP would be a very good player for Miami -- esp. when Wade needs a blow.

C'mon now Randy, I don't think Gary is ready for THAT kind of sacrifice for the team.  

[WayOutWest]

However, I think GP would be a very good player for Miami -- esp. when Wade needs a blow.

C'mon now Randy, I don't think Gary is ready for THAT kind of sacrifice for the team.

And people think Kobe is hard to deal with!  :rofl: uh huh...he wrote "hard".

[Joe Vancil]

First of all, I expect to see Payton STARTING on that team.

Payton hasn't slipped as much as everyone here thinks he has.  True, he's not a spot-up shooter, never has been, and never will be, but he's a scoring threat at the point, a clever distributor, and the best I've ever seen defensively at the point in terms of ROTATIONAL DEFENSE.  Forget "the Glove" hype.  This guy was at his best when the ball was in motion, and the Seattle team was switching match-ups.

That's not Miami's defense, though.  In fact, we really can't say what Miami's defense is going to be.  But if I had to guess, with a back-court of Payton and Wade, I'd have to bet that there's going to be LOTS of pressure applied.  Especially with Mourning or O'Neal waiting in the lane to clean up any mistakes.  And Posey's a pretty good defender, too(although not quite in the class of Eddie Jones, he will be more successful at defending small forwards than Eddie Jones would have been).

People here are SERIOUSLY underrating Payton.  This guy is still an elite guard in the league.  And he's gone to a team where he might get the chance to prove it.

[Guest_Randy]

First of all, I expect to see Payton STARTING on that team.

It's already been stated that GP WON'T be starting in Miami.  Williams will.  So, it's going to be up to GP to take the starting job from Williams.

And Posey's a pretty good defender, too(although not quite in the class of Eddie Jones, he will be more successful at defending small forwards than Eddie Jones would have been).

I agree -- Miami played Jones out of position but I would STILL have rather seen the Heat keep Jones (where are they going to play Walker unless it's SF?).  I would have LOVED to see Miami play Wade and Jones together in the backcourt.  Posey will handle SF's better than Jones but he isn't as good a defender as Jones.

People here are SERIOUSLY underrating Payton. This guy is still an elite guard in the league. And he's gone to a team where he might get the chance to prove it.

GP is in his last few years but he can still ball -- he proved that in Boston last year.  But as for being an ELITE PG?  I can't buy that one.  IMO, there are only a COUPLE of elite PG's in the league today -- Kidd (if he is healthy) and Nash.  There is a TREMENDOUS step from those two PG's to the other decent PG's in the league today -- Arenas, Miller, Bibby, Parker, etc.  Outside of the C position, it's probably the biggest weakness in the NBA today, IMO.  I can't buy that GP is an elite PG -- if he is, then are definations of an elite PG must be WAYYYY off!

[westkoast]

Payton hasn't slipped as much as everyone here thinks he has.  True, he's not a spot-up shooter, never has been, and never will be, but he's a scoring threat at the point, a clever distributor, and the best I've ever seen defensively at the point in terms of ROTATIONAL DEFENSE.  Forget "the Glove" hype.  This guy was at his best when the ball was in motion, and the Seattle team was switching match-ups.

That's not Miami's defense, though.  In fact, we really can't say what Miami's defense is going to be.  But if I had to guess, with a back-court of Payton and Wade, I'd have to bet that there's going to be LOTS of pressure applied.  Especially with Mourning or O'Neal waiting in the lane to clean up any mistakes.  And Posey's a pretty good defender, too(although not quite in the class of Eddie Jones, he will be more successful at defending small forwards than Eddie Jones would have been).

People here are SERIOUSLY underrating Payton.  This guy is still an elite guard in the league.  And he's gone to a team where he might get the chance to prove it.

Joe I did not realize the marijuana in your neck of the woods was so potent.  Have you recently moved up to British Columbia, Canada?  Still an elite guard in this league? Do have a calendar?  We are in the year 2005 and the NBA is starting its 2005-2006 season.  Payton HAS NOT been an elite guard in a while.  A good guard? Yes.  An elite guard? No.  Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, Kobe Bryant, Tracy Mcgrady, Allen Iverson, Dwayne Wade, etc are elite guards.  Payton is not an elite guard.

And yes he has slipped up as much as everyone here thinks.  Not only is he slower (including on rotations) he has had plaging injuries the last 2 seasons.  One of which completely took him out of the loop last year.  

Dont get me wrong, hes very far from horrible.  I honestly think if he can play limited minutes he will be a great player to have on the bench.  Not only because ofh is expierence but because matchup wise it gives Stan Van Gundy some breathing room for that second unit.   Lets come back to earth Joe.  He is not an elite guard anymore.  He hasnt been since he left the Sonics.  He was not that good with the Bucs, was streaky for the Lakers, and was better this past year but again like the year before, was outo f it when it counted (because of that back injury).

[Reality]

First of all, I expect to see Payton STARTING on that team.

People here are SERIOUSLY underrating Payton.  This guy is still an elite guard in the league.  And he's gone to a team where he might get the chance to prove it.

 :rofl:  You made my day.