Sixers at Toronto 11/12 - 7pm

[Derek Bodner]

hey all seemed to stay in this year

Maybe people are starting to pay attention to the history and the trends?  Hardly anyone who goes back ever truly increases their draft prospects - maybe it's coincidence, maybe it's not - but guys who go back tend to drop more in drafts because they become more known quantities - i believe hibbert was an example from the past draft wasn't he?

Hansborough (sp?) from UNC, even before the injury, probably would have been better served to come out earlier because the longer he stays in colleege the more i read about how he's a 'great' college player but probably won't be more than a solid bench guy in the pros.

It goes both ways.  DeAndre jordan's the perfect example of people who should have stayed in school.  Acie Law's a good example of a player who helped himself IMMENSELY by going back to school.  Al Horford as well.

In the end, it's a judgement call.  If you're projected to go in the second half of the first round, like most of these guys where, and you have the physical tools, and belief in yourself that you'll improve, you should probably go back.  If you're a plodding center who really doesn't have much room for improvement, maximize your hype at its highest.  If Hibbert was rated as a top 10 pick after a 12 ppg junior season, someone around him needed to have the foresight to realize his hype was overreaching his basketball talent, and that he should stay in the draft.  The posibility of going from 10th to 6th aren't worth the risk.  The possibility of going from 20th to 8th is.

Ultimately, it's all about having the right support people around him.  Hibbert probably had some stupid agent telling him how great he was and how he was going to dominate his senior year, and he'd be a top 3 pick.  Likewise, Jordan probably had some agent blowing smoke up his ass about how he was the next Dwight, even though everyone and their mother saw how useless he was outside of 3 feet.  In the end, some get it right, some get it wrong.  I don't think there's any blanket (a player should/shouldn't enter the draft as early as possible) declaration that can be made.

[tk76-]

I'm just glad that the Sixers appear to have gotten it right with most of their picks (except Carney- whose class was horrible because of the rule change making HS players enter college that year.)

In some ways, it seems like you have as good a shot at 12-18 as you do from 6-11.  Either way its a crapshoot outside the top 5, so its key to have a good organization and a system to maximize the talent of the right type of player.  The Sixers are arguably half way there.

[anklebreaker]

I'm just glad that the Sixers appear to have gotten it right with most of their picks (except Carney- whose class was horrible because of the rule change making HS players enter college that year.)

In some ways, it seems like you have as good a shot at 12-18 as you do from 6-11.  Either way its a crapshoot outside the top 5, so its key to have a good organization and a system to maximize the talent of the right type of player.  The Sixers are arguably half way there.

If we took Ronnie Brewer when we had the chance instead of Carney we might have actually won that Utah game...

[tk76-]

http://www.nbadraft.net/nba_draft_history/2006.html

Look at that draft after the top 8 picks.  It had about a 90% failure rate, if not worse.  Brewer was the consensus best player, but his R arm deformity argued against him ever being a solid enough shooter to play next to Iguodala.  Carney was the better fit assuming he could end up an NBA starter- which almost nobody after pick 8 were.

Its always a crapshoot outside the top 5 picks, but 2006 was a historically bad draft in that regard.  The talent pool  was just lousy that year. 

[Skates]

http://www.nbadraft.net/nba_draft_history/2006.html

Look at that draft after the top 8 picks.  It had about a 90% failure rate, if not worse.  Brewer was the consensus best player, but his R arm deformity argued against him ever being a solid enough shooter to play next to Iguodala.  Carney was the better fit assuming he could end up an NBA starter- which almost nobody after pick 8 were.

Its always a crapshoot outside the top 5 picks, but 2006 was a historically bad draft in that regard.  The talent pool  was just lousy that year. 

You are being too charitable to that draft.  Other than Aldridge, Roy and Gay the top 8 were quite disappointing as well.  Barngani is improving, but as number one picks go he has been pretty underwhelming so far.  BTW, my preference for that draft would have been to keep Thabo.  I think he will be a decent player, especially defensively, when he gets out of Chicago, the team where promising young players' careers go to die.

[tk76-]

I remember the reaction to drafting Thabo was initially "HUH?" but many people quickly became intrigued when they heard about his skill set (and people were generally down on the other players available except for Marcus Williams and maybe Rondo.)

People were generally disappointed when they heard we traded the pick.  Later, people became excited bu Carney's supposed offensive skill set, only to be ultimately let down by his lousy court sense.

No doubt that draft was comprised of a few good players scattered amongst a wasteland of marginal talent.

[Derek Bodner]

(and people were generally down on the other players available except for Marcus Williams and maybe Rondo.)

I'm pretty sure people were generally fairly fond of Ronnie Brewer as well.  In fact, on the "who we wanted scale", I think it was about 50/50 Brewer/Williams.

[tk76-]

BTW, I just posted this in realgm...

I was looking for a clip of Speights great spin move last night- faking out both J.O. and Bosh.  Couldn't find it- but do you think he has studied the "Dream Shake?"

Check out the shake Hakeem puts on the Admiral 20 sec into this clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29WpgU0pqN8 .  That is nearly the same move Speights made- except Speights was more difficult since he did it running down the lane.

That is a tremendous move for a young quick PF/C to learn.  He may not be the first guy to emeulate that move (you can argue Melvin Ely tries it every time and he's a stiff) but still pretty impressive compared to what we are used to seeing from Sixers bigs.  It takes great balance, quickness and footwork to pull off that type of move when you are close to 7 ft.

[DuckyNinja]

Not quite the same.  Speights ran down the lane, stopped, pumpfaked, then pivoted and hit the baby hook.

[Derek Bodner]

The Dream Shake was probably before your time, but Hakeem could do it from anywhere on the court.  The key of it was driving, stopping on a dime, showing the ball, then pivoting back to either a baby hook, full hook or a fadeaway.  The particularly of where on the court weren't all that important.

It's slightly different, mainly because Speights came to a drop step rather than a pivot, and didn't sell the fake as much, but the key pieces of it were pretty much the same.

[tk76-]

From RealGM- someone posted the Speight's play: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlIjRyRha74

You are right- not really as similar to the Dream Shake as I thought.

But still a great move- and it makes me hope that someone will teach him Hakeem's move, since he has the prerequisite skill set to learn it.

It is a shame that some of the great moves of some of the HOF's of even the recent past are lost.  I understand that there will never be another Hakeem or another McHale, but it is a shame that many players have gone to more athletic or shooting dominance (power games like Shaq or high volume shooters) as opposed to have unique moves/skills.  I am of course over-generalizing...

[bebopdeluxe]

A few more games like last night, and Stefanski is going to have to deal with the reality of having to move Sammy...I just can't see him taking well to Speights taking his minutes.

[DuckyNinja]

Ya know, the thing I noticed in that video is that it was Green that made it happen.  That was a sweet pass.  Green really might be a better PG for this offense than Miller