One more thing, Joe, you made some valid points regarding the HOF, and while Robert Horry has nowhere near the numbers during the regular season, he has had not just a direct impact on 6 of the last 12 NBA Finals, he has had an impact on many playoff games as well, and his presense in this Finals is absolutely the only reason the Spurs are celebrating today, his little steals, his blocks, his long arms disrupting shots, all the little intangibles when it really, really, counts, is why he is HOF material. I would have even agreed with you before this post season that he doesn't belong in the HOF, I posted this topic some months ago and as I recall, the same basic arguments you make now were made then, and then I even agreed, but not anymore, his impact when everything is on the line simply cannot be ignored, the NBA's or your criteria notwithstanding, sometimes a player transcends such mundane things as numbers, Horry is such player.