Bigger surprise: ATL (best record), PHX (returning to form), SA (sub .500)

[westkoast]

What do you guys think? What is the biggest surprise so far in this young season?

The Atlanta Hawks having a better record than Boston, Los Angeles, Orlando, and Cleveland?

The Phoenix Suns going from old dinosaurs not making the playoffs to returning to the Suns we all know (and in my case hate lol)?

The San Antonio Spurs going 4-6 even though many NBA experts (and a few people on this board specifically) picked to be jocking with Los Angeles for the best team in the WC?

[Reality]

Popavich has taken his coaching to new low(er) levels of idiocy with the continued large minutes being given to Bonner and Finley.
Blair, who had all RealSpurs buzzing and who is 3rd in the NBA in rebounding PER, is now in Poppeds *doghouse*.
4-6 is now officially the worst start in 10 years.  Lurker is no doubt still sniffin Pop and saying all is well, Iraqi Minister of Defense style as are all of PopWorshipper Nation.

ATL looks for real, i do not see a collapse coming.

Phx added the right pieces, i can see them giving the Collusionists a run for the money.  But lets hold off on that now that the Lakers have team leader Gasol back.

[Joe Vancil]

Atlanta is the biggest surprise to me.  I quite simply don't think the team is as good as it is playing.

Phoenix looking like Phoenix of a few years ago is surprising.  I thought they'd be okay, but not at the level they're at.

San An, with a sub-.500 record while missing Duncan, Parker, and Ginobilli for stretches and still having Popovich as a coach doesn't surprise me a bit.  While this team continues to rely on Parker rather than Duncan, the team will go south.  But when Duncan and Ginobilli are good and going, San An will be fine.  And Parker is needed if the team is going to be relevant in the post-season.

Other surprises to me:  Indiana is above .500, Milwaukee is above .500, Washington is below .500, Sacramento is at .500, Houston is above .500, and New Orleans is below .500.

New Jersey being the last winless team surprises me.  I'd have picked Charlotte, Houston, and Sacramento instead of them, and put Minnesota, Memphis, and the Clippers in the same category.

[westkoast]

Atlanta is the biggest surprise to me.  I quite simply don't think the team is as good as it is playing.

Phoenix looking like Phoenix of a few years ago is surprising.  I thought they'd be okay, but not at the level they're at.

San An, with a sub-.500 record while missing Duncan, Parker, and Ginobilli for stretches and still having Popovich as a coach doesn't surprise me a bit.  While this team continues to rely on Parker rather than Duncan, the team will go south.  But when Duncan and Ginobilli are good and going, San An will be fine.  And Parker is needed if the team is going to be relevant in the post-season.

Other surprises to me:  Indiana is above .500, Milwaukee is above .500, Washington is below .500, Sacramento is at .500, Houston is above .500, and New Orleans is below .500.

New Jersey being the last winless team surprises me.  I'd have picked Charlotte, Houston, and Sacramento instead of them, and put Minnesota, Memphis, and the Clippers in the same category.

I am going with Atlanta for the same reason you are.  I think this team is playing a lot better than they really are.  I didn't expect them to come out blazing hot.  While I don't expect them to get deep in the playoffs seeing that start I was surprised.

Duncan and Parker have missed one game a piece.  I hardly call that 'stretches'  In the last 3 loses their entire big 4 have been in the lineup so I don't think what is going on is 'expected'  I know it is early in the season but the Spurs don't tend to drop 3 in a row when they play teams like the Thunder.

[Lurker]

Duncan and Parker have missed one game a piece.  I hardly call that 'stretches'  In the last 3 loses their entire big 4 have been in the lineup so I don't think what is going on is 'expected'  I know it is early in the season but the Spurs don't tend to drop 3 in a row when they play teams like the Thunder.

Facts can be tricky koast. 

Parker has played 6 games.  Out of 10.  He has missed 4.

Duncan has played 8 games.  Out of 10.  Missed 2.  And played one on a bum ankle before sitting out.

Manu technically has played 9.  But he only played 7 minutes against Dallas so basically didn't play that game.  And bumped knees in the OKC game and played only the first half.  So Manu played the first 7 games; 18 minutes in the first half vs OKC, 7 minutes in the 1st qtr vs Dallas and sat out vs Utah.

[westkoast]

Duncan and Parker have missed one game a piece.  I hardly call that 'stretches'  In the last 3 loses their entire big 4 have been in the lineup so I don't think what is going on is 'expected'  I know it is early in the season but the Spurs don't tend to drop 3 in a row when they play teams like the Thunder.

Facts can be tricky koast. 

Parker has played 6 games.  Out of 10.  He has missed 4.

Duncan has played 8 games.  Out of 10.  Missed 2.  And played one on a bum ankle before sitting out.

Manu technically has played 9.  But he only played 7 minutes against Dallas so basically didn't play that game.  And bumped knees in the OKC game and played only the first half.  So Manu played the first 7 games; 18 minutes in the first half vs OKC, 7 minutes in the 1st qtr vs Dallas and sat out vs Utah.

 

I was wrong about Parker but since when is one game and 2 games, stretches?   I call stretches weeks at a time with out players.  A 'stretch' is a continuous period of time.  What you are describing is not a continuous period of time of those guys being out.  The Lakers were with out Pau Gasol for a stretch.  Orlando was with out Vince Carter for a stretch.   The Hornets are currently with out Chris Paul for a stretch. 

I know you are upset like this is a personal shot at your Spurs but even Tim Duncan himself said that he is unhappy with what's going on so far and if the playoffs started soon, he thinks they would be in bad shape.  Maybe you should get upset with Tim Duncan as well?  Quite frankly his comment is what made me toss them into the mix.  I was actually going to put New Jersey in the Spurs spot for that horrible start.  I don't think anyone expected them to drop 11 games in a row once RJ left.

[Lurker]

I was wrong about Parker but since when is one game and 2 games, stretches?   I call stretches weeks at a time with out players.  A 'stretch' is a continuous period of time.  What you are describing is not a continuous period of time of those guys being out.  The Lakers were with out Pau Gasol for a stretch.  Orlando was with out Vince Carter for a stretch.   The Hornets are currently with out Chris Paul for a stretch. 

I didn't call it "stretches".  I just didn't want everyone to think there was only "1 games missed" by Parker and Duncan.

I know you are upset like this is a personal shot at your Spurs but even Tim Duncan himself said that he is unhappy with what's going on so far and if the playoffs started soon, he thinks they would be in bad shape.  Maybe you should get upset with Tim Duncan as well?  Quite frankly his comment is what made me toss them into the mix.  I was actually going to put New Jersey in the Spurs spot for that horrible start.  I don't think anyone expected them to drop 11 games in a row once RJ left.

I am not upset.  I agree.  But the Spurs also started last year 5-5 (1-4 start) and ended up in the division race.  Poor showing in the playoffs but it highlighted some weaknesses that were addressed in the offseason.

The Spurs look confused on offense regularly right now.  RJ has beat his man on the perimeter only to run into Duncan or Bonner on the drive.  Spacing is horrible.  And the Spurs are missing their top 2 ball handlers/initiators in Parker and Manu.  When blending in new faces it is difficult with scattered injuries.  IMO Pop should try using RJ in Manu's offensive sets.  Give him the ball on the wing with a screen from a big man and let him create.  Watching the Spurs offense in the 4th quarter of close games has been painful.  Especially so against a disciplined, physical defensive team like Utah.

Defensively they have shown cohesion at times.  They still need to get more consistent.  But it takes time to learn the rotations and build the trust.  Pop is still playing with different combinations.  Some by design; but mostly because of injuries.  Against Utah Hill got a tooth knocked loose (on DWill's non call arm to the face) and McDyess ended up with stitches.  McDyess said that the team seems to have hit a stretch where things just aren't going right.

Parker's missed games have been 4 of the last 5.  You could call that a stretch.  And one would have to wonder how strong that one game was coming off an injury and then re-aggravating it.

Manu has missed the last 2 1/2 games and is expected to be out 7-10 days.  Duncan's missed games were the same as Parker's first 2.

So in the last 5:
Tor  Parker/Duncan out   Manu 36, RJ 24 in Spurs win
Dal  Parker/Duncan out   RJ 29, 4 others in double figues Spurs win
OKC  Manu out 2nd half; 1st game back for TP/TD  Spurs lose by 3 - OKC athleticism hurt last year also.
@ Dal  Parker out/Manu 7 minutes  Spurs lose in OT.  Duncan 22/14 6 assts, 4 blks
Utah   Parker/Manu out.  tied at end of 3rd; no offense in 4th.

I expected the Spurs to start slowly and be around .500 through Dec.  Pop's tendency to experiment with lineups as well as working in new rotation players will lead to that.  Also Pop tries to limit minutes more early in the season and builds up towards the end.  By January you will see a tighter rotation by Pop...especially in crucial games against other contenders.

I wouldn't write off the Spurs so quickly.

[jemagee]

I am not surprised by Washington, I thought people got way too excited about the return of a gunner who missed 2 seasons and the acquisition of two over paid bench players...

New Jersey - I mean they dress 8 people a game, I think they fact that they're close in games so much as a good note for Lawrence Franks.

As a sixer fan, I expected them to be mediocre, 500 at best, but I'm still surprised at how bad they are (combined record of teams they beat so far this season 5-30), and how bad it seems to be going with eddie jordan making comments about players 'psyches' as an excuse for playing less talented players over them....that's a team I think is going to get much worse this season...

I expected Portland to start off better...

[westkoast]

I was wrong about Parker but since when is one game and 2 games, stretches?   I call stretches weeks at a time with out players.  A 'stretch' is a continuous period of time.  What you are describing is not a continuous period of time of those guys being out.  The Lakers were with out Pau Gasol for a stretch.  Orlando was with out Vince Carter for a stretch.   The Hornets are currently with out Chris Paul for a stretch. 

I didn't call it "stretches".  I just didn't want everyone to think there was only "1 games missed" by Parker and Duncan.

I know you are upset like this is a personal shot at your Spurs but even Tim Duncan himself said that he is unhappy with what's going on so far and if the playoffs started soon, he thinks they would be in bad shape.  Maybe you should get upset with Tim Duncan as well?  Quite frankly his comment is what made me toss them into the mix.  I was actually going to put New Jersey in the Spurs spot for that horrible start.  I don't think anyone expected them to drop 11 games in a row once RJ left.

I am not upset.  I agree.  But the Spurs also started last year 5-5 (1-4 start) and ended up in the division race.  Poor showing in the playoffs but it highlighted some weaknesses that were addressed in the offseason.

The Spurs look confused on offense regularly right now.  RJ has beat his man on the perimeter only to run into Duncan or Bonner on the drive.  Spacing is horrible.  And the Spurs are missing their top 2 ball handlers/initiators in Parker and Manu.  When blending in new faces it is difficult with scattered injuries.  IMO Pop should try using RJ in Manu's offensive sets.  Give him the ball on the wing with a screen from a big man and let him create.  Watching the Spurs offense in the 4th quarter of close games has been painful.  Especially so against a disciplined, physical defensive team like Utah.

Defensively they have shown cohesion at times.  They still need to get more consistent.  But it takes time to learn the rotations and build the trust.  Pop is still playing with different combinations.  Some by design; but mostly because of injuries.  Against Utah Hill got a tooth knocked loose (on DWill's non call arm to the face) and McDyess ended up with stitches.  McDyess said that the team seems to have hit a stretch where things just aren't going right.

Parker's missed games have been 4 of the last 5.  You could call that a stretch.  And one would have to wonder how strong that one game was coming off an injury and then re-aggravating it.

Manu has missed the last 2 1/2 games and is expected to be out 7-10 days.  Duncan's missed games were the same as Parker's first 2.

So in the last 5:
Tor  Parker/Duncan out   Manu 36, RJ 24 in Spurs win
Dal  Parker/Duncan out   RJ 29, 4 others in double figues Spurs win
OKC  Manu out 2nd half; 1st game back for TP/TD  Spurs lose by 3 - OKC athleticism hurt last year also.
@ Dal  Parker out/Manu 7 minutes  Spurs lose in OT.  Duncan 22/14 6 assts, 4 blks
Utah   Parker/Manu out.  tied at end of 3rd; no offense in 4th.

I expected the Spurs to start slowly and be around .500 through Dec.  Pop's tendency to experiment with lineups as well as working in new rotation players will lead to that.  Also Pop tries to limit minutes more early in the season and builds up towards the end.  By January you will see a tighter rotation by Pop...especially in crucial games against other contenders.

I wouldn't write off the Spurs so quickly.

Do you honestly believe I would write the Spurs off in November?  That's an insult lol

We all know they start off slow.  I understand they have had the big three in and out.  They are also loaded with talent at 4 positions so it is hard to not notice they are playing sub .500 basketball.   For a team that a lot of NBA experts and the self-proclaimed god of basketball himself (W.O.W) to be at the top of the WC they are sputtering out the gate.  That is surprising to me personally.  Looks like two other posters don't agree with me so no big deal.

And on a side note, no offense but your local tv commentators stink.  Shawn Elliot must be off tonight or something.

[Lurker]

I understand they have had the big three in and out. 

This doesn't match your original statement that got me involved...

In the last 3 loses their entire big 4 have been in the lineup so I don't think what is going on is 'expected' 

And I showed that the big 4 played 1 game out of the last five.  One of the last six with a 3-3 record now if you count last night's win over the Wizards.

And on a side note, no offense but your local tv commentators stink.  Shawn Elliot must be off tonight or something.

They do suck horribly.  I actually prefer watching the TNT or ESPN telecasts than our local.  But sometimes you have to put up with what you got.

[westkoast]

I understand they have had the big three in and out. 

This doesn't match your original statement that got me involved...

In the last 3 loses their entire big 4 have been in the lineup so I don't think what is going on is 'expected' 

And I showed that the big 4 played 1 game out of the last five.  One of the last six with a 3-3 record now if you count last night's win over the Wizards.

And on a side note, no offense but your local tv commentators stink.  Shawn Elliot must be off tonight or something.

They do suck horribly.  I actually prefer watching the TNT or ESPN telecasts than our local.  But sometimes you have to put up with what you got.

Lurker you are missing the reason for my surprise.  Even with injuries I though they had enough talent to play better than .500 basketball.   So far that is not the case.

With one of the 4 guys out on any given game they still should be better than the Kings.  Seriously.

[SPURSX3]

Simmer down there WK.  I dont like SA being sub .500 either but come playoff time I think we will be on board for a Laker showdown.  All that mater to me at this point if that we get to the playoffs in good shape.  The rest of the league...well I don't really care if ATL is the best right now.  PHX is no surprise since they dumped Shaq on cleveland. 

[westkoast]

I think we will be on board for a Laker showdown. 

Yeah you guys will be on board watching the Nuggets/Lakers WCF showdown 

[Reality]

Anyone think Bibby still has it going on in Atlanta?
I'm not saying he still has his 2002 Championship level play but he looks good.

Too bad he turned his ankle, won't be ready to go vs Orlando on Thursday.

[westkoast]

Anyone think Bibby still has it going on in Atlanta?
I'm not saying he still has his 2002 Championship level play but he looks good.

Too bad he turned his ankle, won't be ready to go vs Orlando on Thursday.

He's been average this year (I have em on fantasy).  Don't let one game fool you.  I think Rick Adleman's fluid offense made him look better than he was.  The Bibby that has been outside of the system the last few years is typical Bibby.