Author Topic: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?  (Read 7906 times)

Offline ziggy

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Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« on: September 12, 2009, 04:52:37 PM »
I got a nice bumper crop this year, and tried some new heirloom varieties.  Tried a Mexican variety "Matt's Wild Cherry" that was a tremendous producer, with very sweet small cherry tomatoes.  I tried Purple Calabash for the first time and they were very delicious.  I also tried Belgium Giants for the first time, didn't produce a lot of fruit, but they were very big and tasty. 

I am looking for some other varieties for next year, and I am looking for some opinions.  My standby's are Cherokee Purple, Ponderosa, Mortgage Lifter, Super Sweet 100, and Moneymakers.  I tried a Giant Beefsteak, but it was disappointing.  Didn't produce big fruit, and most of them got a bottom rot.  Any opinions or ideas, I am open for trying some new ones.
A third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. A second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. A first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking.

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AA Mil

Offline Laker Fan

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2009, 05:27:27 PM »
Amish paste are great tomatoes, early producers and similar to Roma's, only a little sweeter and bigger load on the plant, plus a little larger than Roma's. I plant them for tomato sauce because I like a sweeter sauce with a hotter sausage. I got a huge crop of Golden Jubilee's this year, a delicious, meaty, sweet orange tomato that I eat like peaches or put in a mango salsa. I also like the old standby, early girls because I like to start using them as early in the season as possible. You should try Tomatillo's, wonderful little hybrids that are a must for Chile Verde, or traditional salsa.

You live too far north for beefsteaks, they like a longer hotter season so you will never get big fruit, like trying to plant full sized varieties of watermelons too far north, the season isn't long enough, same with hot peppers, of which I might add, had a bumper crop of cayenne's, Ancho's, and a decent crop of blistering hot Habanero's.
Dan

Offline ziggy

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2009, 10:50:49 PM »
Amish paste are great tomatoes, early producers and similar to Roma's, only a little sweeter and bigger load on the plant, plus a little larger than Roma's. I plant them for tomato sauce because I like a sweeter sauce with a hotter sausage. I got a huge crop of Golden Jubilee's this year, a delicious, meaty, sweet orange tomato that I eat like peaches or put in a mango salsa. I also like the old standby, early girls because I like to start using them as early in the season as possible. You should try Tomatillo's, wonderful little hybrids that are a must for Chile Verde, or traditional salsa.

You live too far north for beefsteaks, they like a longer hotter season so you will never get big fruit, like trying to plant full sized varieties of watermelons too far north, the season isn't long enough, same with hot peppers, of which I might add, had a bumper crop of cayenne's, Ancho's, and a decent crop of blistering hot Habanero's.

I will try The Amish Paste.  My brother likes them as well.  I have never been a big fan of Roma's, but you make two fans of Amish paste so I will give it a try.  I will see if I can find some Golden Jubilee seeds.  I have never had much luck with orange tomatoes.  I have had 3-4 varieties, and I can either not get them to germinate, or they just don't produce much.  I like the flavor of orange tomatoes.  I love dark purple and black varieties, and they are a stronger flavor, and the orange seems to be milder, and that would be a good contrast.

I got some really big fruit this year, but my Giant Beefsteak wasn't one of them.  The Ponderosa, Giant Belgium and Mortgage Lifter are beefsteak type, and I had a number of 1 pound + tomatoes.  I had some really nice Cherokee Purples, and I have quite a few more that are not quite ripe.  They are generally medium size, but I got some monsters.  I love them, probably my favorite variety.  They are meaty, but still pretty juicy.  They have a very unique flavor, a bit tarter than a typical red, but also kind of a smokey flavor.  I tried some Black Krim a few years ago, and they were really good as well.  I am thinking about trying a Hillbilly and an Abraham Lincoln next year, instead of the Bonnie Best and Moneymaker. 

We have a very unique climate here, a bit of a banana belt.  We regularly have the greatest daily temp variation in the nation.  We have hot summer days, but very cool nights.  We can hit 90+ during the day throughout the summer, but drop to high 40's at night.  A 50 degree swing is not unusual in the summer, and 30+ degrees in the winter.  Our biggest problem is we can get late spring frosts, and early autumn frosts.  I have a pool which is enclosed in a glass enclosure, so I start my seeds in late February, and transfer them to small pots in March, and big patio containers by the first of May, but I will leave them indoors until the first week of June.  I leave them in containers, so I put them inside a fenced yard.  I have a major problem with Mule Deer, so I can't really have a typical garden.

I had a highly productive Jalapeno' this year, probably 50-60 peppers.  I also have a Serrano, and another pepper that is a bit spicier than an Anaheim.  I tried a Tomatillo a couple of years ago.  It flowered up great, but I never got any fruit.

A third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. A second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. A first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking.

A quotation is a handy thing to have about, saving one the trouble of thinking for oneself.

AA Mil

Offline Laker Fan

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2009, 11:14:31 AM »
I grow Cherokee Purples every year, except this one, very sweet tomato, the only time they're tart is if they're just ripe, let them SLIGHTLY over ripen on the vine and you get a very sweet flesh, I eat them by themselves. I tend to lean toward medium sized varieties, Early Girls, Fourth of July's, Golden Girls, Moneymakers, fruit that produces early and often, although my climate means tomatoes 3/4's of the year, and some hybrids can last a year before the vine dies. Burpees are probably the largest tomato I plant, great for burgers and sandwiches. I don't do a lot of cherries, usually a little too tart for me because I would only use them in salads and I prefer Better Boys for that. You will not be disappointed with Amish Paste I think, because if make your own sauces, they are a low seed drier meat variety and so pulping and cooking down is a breeze, and I don't like a lot of seeds in my sauce, plus they are perfect for making a base paste for any other cooking you do, they reduce faster than any tomato I've tried.

If you do hothouse stuff you should try doing some humid zone 6-8 peppers but get an early start, 6-8 weeks before your last frost, and don't expose them to temps below 40 when they're flowering. That's probably what happened to your Tomatillo's, they do not tolerate cold and need to be hardened before they flower, but man are they perfect for Chile Verde! I love growing them because they take a little extra attention to get a good yield.

I'm thinking from what you told me about your gardening method, you could do some hothouse methods and get a good crop of Cayenne's, Ancho's, Scotch Bonnet's or Habanero's, just be patient because they take forever to ripen, well, not so much the Cayenne's but certainly the hotter ones, if you want max flavor and heat, let the Bonnets and Habenaro's completely ripen on the vine to brilliant orange, then immediately roast (keep your windows open or do it outside or you will wish you were dead) or dry them, if you let them start to shrivel they get bitter. Jalapeno's are great to grow anywhere because they are so popular they have had quite a bit of cold hardiness bred into them, drawback is they lose some of their heat.
Dan

Offline westkoast

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2009, 05:41:02 PM »
I didn't know there was that many types of tomatoes.  Guess you learn something new everyday....

I want to grow my own tomatoes as well but I live in an apartment.  I was thinking about getting one of those upside down hanging Tomato growers.  If I was going to grow on my patio (in southern california, good weather) what would I go for?  I eat A LOT of tomatoes, love to make sauce, etc.
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Offline ziggy

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2009, 08:17:25 PM »
I didn't know there was that many types of tomatoes.  Guess you learn something new everyday....

I want to grow my own tomatoes as well but I live in an apartment.  I was thinking about getting one of those upside down hanging Tomato growers.  If I was going to grow on my patio (in southern california, good weather) what would I go for?  I eat A LOT of tomatoes, love to make sauce, etc.

Wk
There are hundreds and hundreds of different varieties.  I will post a couple of web sites where you can buy heirloom seeds.  I am at work, but I have it as a favorite on my home machine.  Oh and by the way, yes there are a great many purple and gold tomato varieties.  Should be right up your alley.

I have tried both the "Tomato Tree" and the upside down hanging type.  I have had zero luck with the upside down hanging type.  It is hard to fertilize, and way it brings waters into itself didn't work that well.  It was a total waste.  The Tomato Tree (it has a big bag for three tomato plants as well as legs).  It worked much better, but the legs were very poorly designed.  It fell on me three times when I tried to move it just a couple of inches.  I know I know, I shouldn't be an idiot and move it, but you better have it fully figured out before you put the soil and the plants in.  I would recommend that you get a large bucket, and fill it with concrete, and then place the stand in without the legs.  If you do it, make sure you keep the bottom of the stand maybe 2 feet off the ground, or the tomatoes will touch the ground.

A third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. A second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. A first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking.

A quotation is a handy thing to have about, saving one the trouble of thinking for oneself.

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Offline ziggy

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2009, 09:41:10 PM »
Tomato seeds

http://store.tomatofest.com/Heirloom_Tomato_Seeds_s/1.htm

http://www.tomatobob.com/Heirloom-Tomato-Seed-Varieties.htm

http://www.heirloomtomatoes.com/main/index.html

Take a look at these, and if you see something you might like ask and I will let you know if I have ever tried that variety.  I don't plant many hybrid types, I prefer heirloom types.  Many of hybrids are bred for asthetics, or some special growing circumstances.  Don't get me wrong, some hybrids are real good.  Dan mentioned Burpees, and I have raised them, and they are very good.  Early Girls are a highly productive hybrid, I planted some few years ago, and I had so many I gave away more than 1/2 of them.  They had good flavor.

Heirlooms though are better in my opinion.  Generally they have better flavor, though some are older varieties that were naturally bred for some regional advantage (*short growing season, or dry climate etc).  I prefer purple/black, small cherries, beefsteak, and medium sized reds and oranges that are indeterminate vines.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2009, 11:57:12 PM by ziggy »
A third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. A second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. A first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking.

A quotation is a handy thing to have about, saving one the trouble of thinking for oneself.

AA Mil

Offline westkoast

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2009, 09:43:57 AM »
I didn't know there was that many types of tomatoes.  Guess you learn something new everyday....

I want to grow my own tomatoes as well but I live in an apartment.  I was thinking about getting one of those upside down hanging Tomato growers.  If I was going to grow on my patio (in southern california, good weather) what would I go for?  I eat A LOT of tomatoes, love to make sauce, etc.

Wk
There are hundreds and hundreds of different varieties.  I will post a couple of web sites where you can buy heirloom seeds.  I am at work, but I have it as a favorite on my home machine.  Oh and by the way, yes there are a great many purple and gold tomato varieties.  Should be right up your alley.

I have tried both the "Tomato Tree" and the upside down hanging type.  I have had zero luck with the upside down hanging type.  It is hard to fertilize, and way it brings waters into itself didn't work that well.  It was a total waste.  The Tomato Tree (it has a big bag for three tomato plants as well as legs).  It worked much better, but the legs were very poorly designed.  It fell on me three times when I tried to move it just a couple of inches.  I know I know, I shouldn't be an idiot and move it, but you better have it fully figured out before you put the soil and the plants in.  I would recommend that you get a large bucket, and fill it with concrete, and then place the stand in without the legs.  If you do it, make sure you keep the bottom of the stand maybe 2 feet off the ground, or the tomatoes will touch the ground.



Thanks for the tip.  That was really what I was worried about and why I had not already bought one.  I never trust anything that shows up on an infomercial lol

Ill take a look at the links and come back to post.  Really one of my main drives for wanting to grow my own tomatoes is I just don't feel like the tomatoes I get at the store have a consistent flavor from trip to trip.   Dan mentioned Amish paste and sauce so I may look into that.
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Offline Laker Fan

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2009, 12:44:57 PM »
I agree zig heirlooms are my favorites, but hybrids have come a long way in. My biggest reason fro going for certain hybrids are their consistency and productivity, but the flavor of heirlooms are hard to beat. Hybrids really thrive in climate specific regions for which they were bred and if you are limited in space and can only do a few plants, they are the best option IMO. I do 25-30 plants a year so I can afford to experiment. I make a lot of salsa and sauces so I tend to focus on varieties that fill that purpose, Amish Paste, Roma's for sauce, Early Girls, Jubilee's and types like those for salsa, Burpee's and Cherokee's for slicers.

'Koast, if you don't have a green thumb or a are a novice, heirlooms can be more challenging because you must plant from seed, but even at that tomatoes are easy from seed. There are excellent nurseries in Orange County to buy hardened hybrid plants just coming into flower, and even good starts for heirlooms like Brandywines. Tomatoes are a huge crop in California and so expertise and good starters are everywhere, I agree with Zig, those little upside down gimmicks are an absolute joke, depending on the tomato you are growing, some must be side-dressed and you can't do that with one of those things plus it is counter intuitive to think you can water a plant when the water drains AWAY from the root system rather than toward it, tomatoes are thirsty plants but they don't drink through leaves. That other one with the legs seems a little too complicated for no reason. My suggestion is to get yourself a good fairly wide 3-5 gallon planter bucket, put a tray under it to catch water, put your plant in a good nitrogen rich soil, although tomatoes tolerate average to below average soil, there is obviously less need to side dress or amend/fertilize if you start off with good soil, the key is to water evenly and don't let them dry out. Because you are doing containers, determinate's ( bush type that only grow so big and stop) are best because they are compact, produce earlier, and some need little if any staking, Try both types though so you get a long season out of them, put the indeterminate's (larger, vine types that MUST be staked and produce later in the season) in the larger containers and I prefer a cage over straight stakes or a trellis and the larger container will handle a round cage better.

You can go to a good nursery and see if they have any empty 3-5 gallon plastic nursery planters laying around from transplants or plants that died, usually they give them away because they are cheap but they might ask for a couple bucks for them, either way, they're wider and have drain holes to prevent root rot, tomatoes don't have huge root system so root binding isn't an issues in containers that size.

Definitely try some heirlooms, they are closer to what Native Americans grew and are very traditional, some varieties are over a hundred years old. Tomatoes are always linked to the Italians but they are native to the America's and were not introduced to Europe until Columbus invasion set in motion the importation on maize and tomatoes in the 1500's. Don't forget to try some Tomatillo's, So Cal is the perfect climate for them, just harden them to the sun prior to full exposure.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2009, 01:03:37 PM by Laker Fan »
Dan

Offline Laker Fan

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2009, 12:45:59 PM »
BTW Zig, thanks for a couple of those links, I hadn't been to those sites.
Dan

Offline ziggy

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2009, 07:27:37 PM »
I agree zig heirlooms are my favorites, but hybrids have come a long way in. My biggest reason fro going for certain hybrids are their consistency and productivity, but the flavor of heirlooms are hard to beat. Hybrids really thrive in climate specific regions for which they were bred and if you are limited in space and can only do a few plants, they are the best option IMO. I do 25-30 plants a year so I can afford to experiment. I make a lot of salsa and sauces so I tend to focus on varieties that fill that purpose, Amish Paste, Roma's for sauce, Early Girls, Jubilee's and types like those for salsa, Burpee's and Cherokee's for slicers.

'Koast, if you don't have a green thumb or a are a novice, heirlooms can be more challenging because you must plant from seed, but even at that tomatoes are easy from seed. There are excellent nurseries in Orange County to buy hardened hybrid plants just coming into flower, and even good starts for heirlooms like Brandywines. Tomatoes are a huge crop in California and so expertise and good starters are everywhere, I agree with Zig, those little upside down gimmicks are an absolute joke, depending on the tomato you are growing, some must be side-dressed and you can't do that with one of those things plus it is counter intuitive to think you can water a plant when the water drains AWAY from the root system rather than toward it, tomatoes are thirsty plants but they don't drink through leaves. That other one with the legs seems a little too complicated for no reason. My suggestion is to get yourself a good fairly wide 3-5 gallon planter bucket, put a tray under it to catch water, put your plant in a good nitrogen rich soil, although tomatoes tolerate average to below average soil, there is obviously less need to side dress or amend/fertilize if you start off with good soil, the key is to water evenly and don't let them dry out. Because you are doing containers, determinate's ( bush type that only grow so big and stop) are best because they are compact, produce earlier, and some need little if any staking, Try both types though so you get a long season out of them, put the indeterminate's (larger, vine types that MUST be staked and produce later in the season) in the larger containers and I prefer a cage over straight stakes or a trellis and the larger container will handle a round cage better.

You can go to a good nursery and see if they have any empty 3-5 gallon plastic nursery planters laying around from transplants or plants that died, usually they give them away because they are cheap but they might ask for a couple bucks for them, either way, they're wider and have drain holes to prevent root rot, tomatoes don't have huge root system so root binding isn't an issues in containers that size.

Definitely try some heirlooms, they are closer to what Native Americans grew and are very traditional, some varieties are over a hundred years old. Tomatoes are always linked to the Italians but they are native to the America's and were not introduced to Europe until Columbus invasion set in motion the importation on maize and tomatoes in the 1500's. Don't forget to try some Tomatillo's, So Cal is the perfect climate for them, just harden them to the sun prior to full exposure.

Wk, Laker Dan really nailed this.  Save this.
A third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. A second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. A first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking.

A quotation is a handy thing to have about, saving one the trouble of thinking for oneself.

AA Mil

Offline westkoast

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2009, 10:01:58 AM »
I agree zig heirlooms are my favorites, but hybrids have come a long way in. My biggest reason fro going for certain hybrids are their consistency and productivity, but the flavor of heirlooms are hard to beat. Hybrids really thrive in climate specific regions for which they were bred and if you are limited in space and can only do a few plants, they are the best option IMO. I do 25-30 plants a year so I can afford to experiment. I make a lot of salsa and sauces so I tend to focus on varieties that fill that purpose, Amish Paste, Roma's for sauce, Early Girls, Jubilee's and types like those for salsa, Burpee's and Cherokee's for slicers.

'Koast, if you don't have a green thumb or a are a novice, heirlooms can be more challenging because you must plant from seed, but even at that tomatoes are easy from seed. There are excellent nurseries in Orange County to buy hardened hybrid plants just coming into flower, and even good starts for heirlooms like Brandywines. Tomatoes are a huge crop in California and so expertise and good starters are everywhere, I agree with Zig, those little upside down gimmicks are an absolute joke, depending on the tomato you are growing, some must be side-dressed and you can't do that with one of those things plus it is counter intuitive to think you can water a plant when the water drains AWAY from the root system rather than toward it, tomatoes are thirsty plants but they don't drink through leaves. That other one with the legs seems a little too complicated for no reason. My suggestion is to get yourself a good fairly wide 3-5 gallon planter bucket, put a tray under it to catch water, put your plant in a good nitrogen rich soil, although tomatoes tolerate average to below average soil, there is obviously less need to side dress or amend/fertilize if you start off with good soil, the key is to water evenly and don't let them dry out. Because you are doing containers, determinate's ( bush type that only grow so big and stop) are best because they are compact, produce earlier, and some need little if any staking, Try both types though so you get a long season out of them, put the indeterminate's (larger, vine types that MUST be staked and produce later in the season) in the larger containers and I prefer a cage over straight stakes or a trellis and the larger container will handle a round cage better.

You can go to a good nursery and see if they have any empty 3-5 gallon plastic nursery planters laying around from transplants or plants that died, usually they give them away because they are cheap but they might ask for a couple bucks for them, either way, they're wider and have drain holes to prevent root rot, tomatoes don't have huge root system so root binding isn't an issues in containers that size.

Definitely try some heirlooms, they are closer to what Native Americans grew and are very traditional, some varieties are over a hundred years old. Tomatoes are always linked to the Italians but they are native to the America's and were not introduced to Europe until Columbus invasion set in motion the importation on maize and tomatoes in the 1500's. Don't forget to try some Tomatillo's, So Cal is the perfect climate for them, just harden them to the sun prior to full exposure.

Thank you sir, 'ppreciate it.  Going to try to fit in a run to a nursery this weekend before I put it off for other things.
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Offline Lurker

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2009, 05:30:15 PM »
Been a little out of touch lately.

But let me add a couple things (mostly from my scientist wife).  Tomatoes are big nitrogen users.  If you are going to replant in the same area then make sure you add a heavy nitrogen mix to the soil.  We have a community garden that we have participated in and have success with different varieties.  We have tried using excess seeds in pots and have had limited success.  Thsi year the drought wiped out a lot of production.
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Offline Laker Fan

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2009, 07:59:05 PM »
Been a little out of touch lately.

But let me add a couple things (mostly from my scientist wife).  Tomatoes are big nitrogen users.  If you are going to replant in the same area then make sure you add a heavy nitrogen mix to the soil.  We have a community garden that we have participated in and have success with different varieties.  We have tried using excess seeds in pots and have had limited success.  Thsi year the drought wiped out a lot of production.



Thanks for confirming what I said Lurker, I have always used nitrogen amendments or started off with a good nitrogen rich soil, makes the growing process more worry free, another thing it prevents is bottom rot as it keeps the salt level low, salt KILLS tomatoes and salt leaches very quickly into a nitrogen depleted soil.

So, you guys do a community garden? How exactly does that work? Do you get your own plot you're responsible for or does everyone kind of help each other out? I've always thought that was kind of a cool way to do a garden, especially if you have no space at your own place.
Dan

Offline Lurker

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Re: Anybody else here have a tomato garden?
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2009, 07:26:41 PM »

So, you guys do a community garden? How exactly does that work? Do you get your own plot you're responsible for or does everyone kind of help each other out? I've always thought that was kind of a cool way to do a garden, especially if you have no space at your own place.

It is at the yoga studio where we practice.  It is a whoever wants to help can; but usually we have so much produce that we share it freely with other yoga students who never help.  We generally plant tomatoes, bell peppers, yellow crookneck squash, and watermelon.  Then we will add a couple other things - veggies we have tried: radishes, string beans, zucchini, eggplant, carrots.  We have tried a winter garden with some lettuces and spinach but generally there seems to be less help and it doesn't do as well.  We also keep basil, peppermint, chives, rosemary and other herbs.
It riles them to believe that you perceive the web they weave.  Keep on thinking free.
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