Author Topic: OT: The Stock market's direction  (Read 1632 times)

Offline rickortreat

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OT: The Stock market's direction
« on: April 29, 2009, 10:53:49 AM »
Although the market has been rising lately, reports of massive selling by insiders suggest that the smart people are trying to get out while the getting is good.

To my mind the market is going up not on any good news or any rational reason about business conditions. It is being bought by the Fed through their minions as they try desperately to keep things appearing normal, while the financial system is under severe pressure.

In any case, the market's long term trend remains down, so if you have money in it, you would be wise to move it to cash while you can still profit from it's interim rise.  I expect the Market to keep rising until it hits resistance, in a few days. This gives you the time to act.

If I am wrong, you can always buy back in later without suffering much of a loss.

Once this rally fails, the market will head back below 7500 on the $indu's. We are currently at 8177 on a suspiciously strong up day (+160)


The Gold market is in a real fight right now, as there are a number of people hoping to benefit by keeping the price down. (In any futures market there is a tendency to do this, but in the case of gold which is a very thin market it is a dangerous game- or rather would be if the COT was serious about stopping illegal naked short selling. In spite of the pressure, buyers are holding the line and pushing it up slightly higher. We are at $900 now, but i would not say the bulls are in control. Best to wait and see if you aren't in.  If you are in, enjoy the current rise but be wary.

In a world where all currencies are under threat because of the faltering economy they are engaged in "monetary easing" which means printing more and more money and lending it out at favorable terms. This sea of paper will eventually push the price up in everything. The Weimar republic saw huge market gains while it's currency failed. We are too early in the cycle for this to occur, but it's important to recognize the potential.

The real issue is actual business conditions and governments attempts to try and help. It was in fact their "help" sic that has caused this problem in the first place.

We saw the market pop in 2000, and then we saw a new bubble that blew up last year, this time bringing down the banks and the housing market. It appears they are trying to blow up another bubble, in an attempt to protect property owners, but it can't work unless the money finds it's way into people's hands. You aren't going to borrow to buy a house when you aren't making enough simple as that.  And the same goes for business- you won't borrow to expand your business unless you know that the demand in your market is solid. About the only businesses that are solid now are the foreclosure markets and repo businesses.

Offline rickortreat

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Re: OT: The Stock market's direction
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2009, 02:38:48 PM »
For those of you interested in understanding naked short selling, here's an article from the NY Times:

http://tinyurl.com/cbvz3s

Basically a naked short seller is one who sells shares into the market, but never delivers.  The problem is, that the shares don't actually exist, and the seller never borrowed them. Consider that allowing this can enable someone to sell a company down to nothing by overwhelming willing buyers.  A company could be destroyed by such activity, or end up being owned for pennies on the dollar.

Now if only they would apply the same rule to the Toronto Exchange, where most of the expoloration gold companies trade...

Offline westkoast

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Re: OT: The Stock market's direction
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2009, 03:02:00 PM »
Rick I read an article yesterday saying that the commercial real estate market is going to crash as bad as the housing market did sometime in September.  Have you read much about it and what are your thoughts?  Ill have to look for a link to the article.
http://I-Really-Shouldn't-Put-A-Link-To-A-Blog-I-Dont-Even-Update.com

Offline rickortreat

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Re: OT: The Stock market's direction
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2009, 12:00:24 PM »
Rick I read an article yesterday saying that the commercial real estate market is going to crash as bad as the housing market did sometime in September.  Have you read much about it and what are your thoughts?  Ill have to look for a link to the article.

Judging from the business climate in general and news of big-box stores like Circuit City going under, it should be no surprise that commercial real estate would also come under serious pressure. It's not a market I pay attention to, but it's impossible not to notice all of the going out of business sales, and the ever-increasing number of empty store-fronts.

Do you know of any commercial real-estate firms that trade on the market?  I would suspect they would be ideal candidates to buy put options on.  Market is getting ever closer to that downturn...

Offline westkoast

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Re: OT: The Stock market's direction
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2009, 06:31:01 PM »
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/227/story/67187.html
By Kevin G. Hall    | McClatchy Newspapers
WASHINGTON ? Two years after fissures in the residential housing market gave way to a national collapse of home prices and sales, experts warn the next shoe to drop is the commercial real-estate market, bringing more woes to the battered economy.

Thousands of commercial mortgages valued at hundreds of billions of dollars are approaching a renewal date. By some estimates, two out of every three will no longer meet the original loan conditions and won't be able to refinance. And with prices for commercial properties expected to plunge, a vicious cycle may unfold much as it has in the nation's housing market.

"It's the next wave to hit. It's the next round of bad news," said Scott Talbott, the senior vice president of government affairs for the Financial Services Roundtable, a trade group for big banks and other financial institutions who are collectively concerned about the coming problems.

A commercial mortgage meltdown is likely to prolong the nation's economic recovery. The falling prices in commercial real estate will lead to additional bank losses at a time when banks are sapped by home mortgage defaults and soaring credit card defaults. This could lead to future additional taxpayer assistance for the banks.

The reality is already on display. On April 16, the nation's second largest mall developer, General Growth Properties, filed for bankruptcy protection. The Chicago-based company owns more than 200 malls across the U.S., and was unable to renegotiate its debts as they came due.

Six days later, a 40-story office tower on New York's Avenue of the Americas was seized by its creditor, a Canadian-owned pension fund. The tower's owner, Macklowe Properties, couldn't meet loan terms.

"On the street, the rumor is it is coming and it's going to come fast and furious. Some people are predicting September," said Paul Waters, a New York-based executive vice president of brokerage operations in North America for NAI Global, a top-five commercial real estate brokerage with operations across the globe.

Just like the housing meltdown, the commercial real estate crunch is likely to begin as a slow bleed that gains momentum. The coming commercial real-estate crunch is likely to be spread evenly across the nation, in large part because of an outgoing economic tide that's spared few companies anywhere.

"There's going to be a lot of trouble on Main Street with some of these commercial and industrial buildings. The biggest impact will be on some of the smaller owners," Waters said. "The smaller local regional players that are stretched thin may have some great difficulties with their mortgages."

How bad it gets will depend on speed of economic recovery. Office space and multifamily apartments, two huge components of commercial real estate, are highly dependent on employment. Even if the economy begins growing again late this year as forecast, the number of unemployed is expected to keep rising well into next year.

"The translation is that office vacancy rates would continue to rise until mid-to late-2010," said Christopher Cornell, an economist specializing in commercial real estate for Moody's Economy.com, adding that "it's a drag on the recovery" well into next year.

The last crisis in commercial real estate ? which includes office space, malls, industrial parks and multifamily apartments ? came in the early 1990s. The problem then was an oversupply of new properties. Today, the driver is a deep economic downturn, with the economy contracting by more than 6 percent in each of the last two quarters.

As in the housing meltdown, weakened lending standards are a big part of the story for commercial real estate. Unlike housing, however, the ill effects from weakened commercial lending standards have been camouflaged to date because they've had a longer horizon than housing did over which to implode.

"If you take a look between 2005 and 2007, the underwriting standards on both the consumer side and the commercial side were spinning out of control," said Kevin Blakely, the president of the Risk Management Association, a Philadelphia-based trade group for financial risk managers. "I think it is a bigger issue than we like to admit."

In housing, many of the loans with poor underwriting went bad within two years, when adjustable-rate mortgages were due to reset to higher interest rates and raise monthly payment costs for homeowners.

However, commercial properties carry mortgages with lives of five years or 10 years. And these loans issued from 1999 to 2007 are coming up for a rollover ? refinancing under similar terms. Today's economic downturn and credit crunch makes that unlikely, however, as credit standards have tightened.

As in housing, many commercial properties have mortgages that were bundled together in pools, sliced and diced and instead of being held by banks were sold to investors as bonds and securities. Thousands of these commercial mortgage-backed securities, or CMBS, are reaching their maturity dates over the next three years. Ten-year mortgages issued in 1999 and 2000 start coming due late this year, and five-year loans issued from 2005 to 2007 come due early next year.

"If you stop and think about what is coming up for maturity over the next couple of years, either on the banks' books or CMBS, there is going to be a day of reckoning as those loans mature and they have to be rebalanced and reset to today's underwriting standards," said Blakely, who worked 17 years as a bank regulator followed by 17 years as a bank executive and risk officer.

A March study by the Wall Street arm of Deutsche Bank, Germany's largest financial institution, points to this day of reckoning. It found that the number of U.S. commercial loans that hadn't refinanced within a month of their end date had tripled.

Refinancing usually happens months ahead of the end date. Since October, commercial refinancing has dropped from a pace of more than 400 mortgages a month to fewer than 100 a month, the bank said.

The report, entitled "Commercial Real Estate at the Precipice," said that under lenient underwriting standards, 56.8 percent of existing commercial mortgages wouldn't qualify for refinancing. Using conservative standards, two thirds won't make the grade.

That suggests that lenders will have to extend loans, much like they've tried to freeze adjustable-rate residential mortgages at their original lower rate to avoid a foreclosure. Even if the commercial loans are simply extended for a year or two, however, commercial real-estate prices are forecast to keep dropping so the time bomb will be delayed not defused, the report concluded.

"In our view, much of these losses are unavoidable, even in a mass (loan) extension environment," wrote Richard Parkus, the report's author.

Forecaster Moody's Economy.com expects $375 billion in losses on the $3.5 trillion in commercial mortgage loans and securities outstanding. That a loss rate of about 11 percent, nearly twice the rate of home mortgage foreclosures, and the forecaster thinks that about $200 billion of those commercial losses are still ahead.

"This is significant, but small compared to the over $1.1 trillion losses ultimately expected on residential mortgage loans and securities. Commercial mortgage losses will be a significant problem for many mid-sized and small banks," said Mark Zandi, the chief economist for Moody's Economy.com. "In fact, most of the banking failures that occur in the next several years will be due to losses on commercial mortgage loans."

Earlier this year, the Treasury Department and Federal Reserve announced a program in which they'll lend to investors willing to purchase the safest, top-rated commercial mortgage-backed securities. The Fed is trying to use its power as a lender of last resort to help keep some credit flowing into commercial real estate markets. This effort, however, is of limited importance because it targets the safest of commercial mortgages and won't address all that ails this important sector.

Additionally, pools of commercial mortgages are expected to be included in the auction of so-called toxic assets being readied by the Treasury Department through a public-private partnership.

Still, commercial real-estate brokers are bracing for protracted hard times.

"There will be a re-engineering of the culture of the real estate business," said Waters, the NAI Global executive, who expects few new development projects until the mortgage problem runs its course. "All the avenues to dispose (of bad commercial loans) are going to be utilized."
http://I-Really-Shouldn't-Put-A-Link-To-A-Blog-I-Dont-Even-Update.com

Offline rickortreat

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Re: OT: The Stock market's direction
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2009, 11:21:00 AM »
Thanks for that post.  Another sign of what is to be expected.

Yesterday the market (The Dow) rose closer to my anticipated target and sure enough we now have a down day. Probably much to the chagrin of the talking heads which thought it would go higher.  I still think we have a little way to go to the upside before the downturn starts in earnest.  As I posted earlier we should head down to the bottom of the channel then, wiping out the gains made over the past 3 months since the last interim bottom in March. 

Prices are still pretty high compared to when I first posted, abd we haven't peaked just yet so you still have some time to get out. It's not like the market is going to fall off right away- we're still away from the panic selling that characterized the big decline last year. It is a misconception that the smart money gets out at the top, a lot of shares can be sold on the way down. Very few are ever able to get the timing exactly right, and it doesn't matter if you do. If you can catch 80% of each multi-month upswing or downswing, you can outperform any mutual fund.

Unless the market surprises me and breaks through to the upside of my trendline, I won't post an update until I think we're close to the bottom again when it will be time to buy back in.

Gold is starting to look stronger again, but it's still around the $900 level.  The anti-gold group is probably in good shape and will want to smack it down again. More gold will have to be taken out of the warehouses to scare away the COT from selling short.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2009, 11:25:59 AM by rickortreat »

Offline rickortreat

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Re: OT: The Stock market's direction
« Reply #6 on: May 20, 2009, 11:04:23 AM »
Thanks to the strange activities in the market, I had to post again.  The downturn I was anticipating still hasn't come.  In fact, the Indu's went right to the upper trend line and fell back, but then bottomed and rose again.  8,500 on the Indu's is where we are now, and If the Indu's can keep it there, we may not see that anticpated decline.

The Gold market on the other hand has finally broken through the artificial lid on it's price.  What is doing in the bullion banks now?  The Quantitative Easing (Wild ass printing of money) is starting to affect the price of the dollar. Dollar down, Gold up.  The upper price was $930. Everytime it got there, big sellers came into the market. Today those selllers got overwhelmed.  We are now at $936 and this should be the start of an explosive move up in Gold. $936 might sound expensive to you, but it is all relative, 2 years from now it will be at least $1,200 and possibly quite higher.  The good gold stocks like GG and copper giant FCX are perking up nicely, but still relative bargains considering where they will be.  Be carefull wth FCX since the base metals market may decline in lock-step with the world's economy, and their main business is Copper. 

So to sum up, Gold stocks are a good buy now. The rest of the market is still ok, and even though I still anticipate a fall, it has not occurred yet. I can find no reason for the buying, but I never argue with the tape, if it says up, I stop selling.