Author Topic: My grades of the trades....  (Read 19098 times)

Offline Derek Bodner

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #15 on: March 24, 2008, 04:07:21 PM »
Quote
What did West have to do with Memphis?

He still hasn't figured out that Jerry West is no longer with the Grizzlies.

Offline Reality

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #16 on: March 24, 2008, 04:25:16 PM »
No, and his **consultant** title with the Grizzleys would absolutely proclude him from helping the Lakers.  Deals like that never happen in the real world. :D :D

Kwame for Gasol was the best the Grizzleys could do after shopping Gasol all over the league.

Gullible.

Offline WayOutWest

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #17 on: March 24, 2008, 04:37:50 PM »
No, and his **consultant** title with the Grizzleys would absolutely proclude him from helping the Lakers.  Deals like that never happen in the real world. :D :D

Kwame for Gasol was the best the Grizzleys could do after shopping Gasol all over the league.

Gullible.

So by your logic KG to the Celtics is collusion?
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Offline westkoast

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #18 on: March 24, 2008, 04:41:11 PM »
No, and his **consultant** title with the Grizzleys would absolutely proclude him from helping the Lakers.  Deals like that never happen in the real world. :D :D

Kwame for Gasol was the best the Grizzleys could do after shopping Gasol all over the league.

Gullible.

He's not a consultant with them....
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Offline Reality

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #19 on: March 24, 2008, 05:06:06 PM »
So by your logic KG to the Celtics is collusion?
By my logic Al Jeffersons 21 points 12 boards a game at age 23, Gerald Green the slam dunk winner/finalist and Theo Ratliffs expiring contract completely trumps
Kwame n filler for Gasol.

I also believe other teams had a legit chance to trade for KG, ie Phx.
The Lakers would not give up SuperByns, so there you have it.

Al Jeffersons 21/12 slightly outdoes Kwamster.

Next.

Offline westkoast

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #20 on: March 24, 2008, 05:16:12 PM »
So by your logic KG to the Celtics is collusion?
By my logic Al Jeffersons 21 points 12 boards a game at age 23, Gerald Green the slam dunk winner/finalist and Theo Ratliffs expiring contract completely trumps
Kwame n filler for Gasol.

I also believe other teams had a legit chance to trade for KG, ie Phx.
The Lakers would not give up SuperByns, so there you have it.

Al Jeffersons 21/12 slightly outdoes Kwamster.

Next.

You can't compare a trade that was done with getting personal in mind to one that was strictly motivated by getting people off the books.  If the Grizz actually wanted players to play, they would have traded for it.  They however wanted an expiring contract that was a decent amount of money.

And if you want to get down to it Jarvis is a better young pick then Green is.  Not to mention the rights to Pau's brother is important as well as hes doing very well overseas.  The deal was not for Kwame straight up so.......stop acting like it was lol
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Offline Derek Bodner

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #21 on: March 24, 2008, 08:11:30 PM »
Quote
No, and his **consultant** title with the Grizzleys would absolutely proclude him from helping the Lakers.  Deals like that never happen in the real world

Except he's not a paid consultant, nor is he a decision maker even if he was (which he's not.  He said when Wallace was hired that he'd be open to being a consultant, as a courtesy.  He is not on staff as a consultant).

Quote
Kwame for Gasol was the best the Grizzleys could do after shopping Gasol all over the league.

Except you missed the parts of the trade that actually matter (Crittenton, draft picks, cap space).  But then again, I wouldn't expect you to actually think about the salary cap.

I also must have missed where a poor trade is proof of collusion.

But yeah, the Grizzlies just ruined their future because of the advice of an unpaid consultant.  Conspiracy theorists unite!

Stackhouse.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2008, 08:15:45 PM by Derek Bodner »

Offline Randy

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #22 on: March 24, 2008, 10:53:08 PM »
No, and his **consultant** title with the Grizzleys would absolutely proclude him from helping the Lakers.  Deals like that never happen in the real world. :D :D

Kwame for Gasol was the best the Grizzleys could do after shopping Gasol all over the league.

Gullible.

Okay, I'm not sure why you can't understand this -- the Grizz weren't looking for talent to play for them right away -- they were looking for a couple of things:  1) to dump as much salary off their books as possible; 2) to get as much for Pau Gasol as possible WITHOUT taking on salary; 3) to get rights to the best player who ISN'T under contract at this point or to get top future draft picks.  Okay, I'm trying to type slow so that you understand.

Memphis DIDN'T want to add players to their current roster -- they wanted to dump players (i.e. their salary).  So they looked at what was available to them -- they were giving up an All-Star player who was already uphappy in Memphis so they tried to get the most they could get for him under the previously stated conditions.  In MARC GASOL, Memphis saw a way to trade for a player who looks to be the next coming of Pau Gasol -- and they could get him WITHOUT having his salary on their books.  They also got a huge expiring contract and a great looking young player in Crittendom.  They now have several young point guards with a great deal of talent -- I could see the Grizz making another trade with one or two of these guards for future draft picks. 

If you can name a better player than Marc Gasol who is out there who isn't under contract, please do so.  The Grizz were trying to dump salary to bring down their net worth in order to make a sale more attractive were also trying to ensure some kind of a future as well.  I think Marc Gasol is going to do well in this league -- he looks a lot like Pau Gasol to me -- just younger.  Memphis is going to struggle, of course, but they will look attractive to someone who wants to buy a new franchise. 

I would also imagine that the Grizz will look to move -- Memphis hasn't done well since moving there.

Oh, it's sooo funny seeing your post about the collusion with the Mavs/Nets only to deflect when the same scenario happens with the Spurs and Barry.  There was NO difference whatsoever -- he still LIVES in the city with his family and knows the system -- the chances of him not returning were nil (esp. with everything Pop said about him as he left -- basically, "hey Brent, we'll turn down your sheets and put a mint on your pillow every night if you come back").  The chances were the same with Stackhouse AND Barry -- neither were going to consider going with another team -- the difference is that one of them plays for the Spurs!

Offline ziggy

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #23 on: March 25, 2008, 01:15:06 AM »
2) to get as much for Pau Gasol as possible WITHOUT taking on salary

So the most they could get was two late first round picks in the 25-30 range, Marc Gasol, and Javaris Crittenton? This the best they could get?  Randy, I don't agree with Reality on the collusion thing, but please spare me the BS about this was the best deal they could get without taking on salary.  They were stupid, and the Lakers were the beneficiaries, but DO NOT INSULT THE INTELLIGENCE OF THIS ENTIRE BOARD AND MAKE THE CLAIM THAT THEY COULD NOT HAVE GOT MORE WITHOUT TAKING ON SALARY.  They didn't get squat.

In MARC GASOL, Memphis saw a way to trade for a player who looks to be the next coming of Pau Gasol -- and they could get him WITHOUT having his salary on their books.   

Show me one incident, or one published report where anyone, besides yourself, or any other mouth breathing, booger eating Laker fan who would make that ridiculous assertion.  HE WAS A SECOND ROUND PICK FOR CHRIST SAKE.  IF HE IS SO DAMN GOOD WHY DID HE SLIP TO THE SECOND ROUND?  WHAT HAS HE DONE IN SPAIN?

They also got a huge expiring contract and a great looking young player in Crittendom.  They now have several young point guards with a great deal of talent -- I could see the Grizz making another trade with one or two of these guards for future draft picks. 
 

Crittenton is not a great looking young player.  In 20 games in Memphis, one of the very worst teams in the league (5-15 in those 20 games), Crittenton has scored in double figures 4 times, had more than 1 assist a whopping 3 times, is scoring a whopping 6.3 ppg, with less than an assist per game while shooting 37.7% on 2's, 16.7 on 3's, and 64.3 on FT.  That is not the stat line of a great looking young player.  So save me the hyperbole on the future greatness of Javaris Crittenton.


If you can name a better player than Marc Gasol who is out there who isn't under contract, please do so.
Rudy Fernandez, Fran Vazquez, David Anderson

The Grizz were trying to dump salary to bring down their net worth in order to make a sale more attractive were also trying to ensure some kind of a future as well. 

Randy that is just plain stupid.  Nobody try's to reduce their net worth to make a sale more attractive.  You are basically saying their logic was "lets do everything we can to reduce the value of our franchise, so it will be eaiser to sell it, for less money"  The owner of Grizzlies didn't make billions by doing stupid stuff like that.

I think Marc Gasol is going to do well in this league -- he looks a lot like Pau Gasol to me -- just younger. 
 

I have read quote's from a lot of scouts who say he is not even close to Pau.  Pau was the 3rd pick in the draft, Marc was drafted in the second round.  How many second rounders from Europe make it as a good pro in the NBA?  So far only 1, Manu, out of dozens upon dozens of Euro's drafted in the second round.  Most scouts consider him to be a marginal prospect at best, if he makes the league at all

Memphis is going to struggle, of course, but they will look attractive to someone who wants to buy a new franchise.
 

and they will look attractive for what reason???  They have one of the worst franchises in the league, and their best player, Mike Miller, is not even close to being an all-star.  Rudy Gay looks like he will be a good player, Mike Conley is an unknown quantity, Hakim Warrick is a mediocre NBA starter, and Crittenton has shown little so far.  What else do they have?  They are slightly better than an expansion franchise would be.  They have been losing buckloads of money in Memphis, which will require a very costly move to another city.  So little talent, a couple of extra low first round picks, a crappy situation in Memphis, the Bird rights to Kwame Brown, and Homer J Simpson for a GM.  That is a really attractive franchise, I am sure someone is just waiting plunk down 300 to 400 million.  Whoo Hooo.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2008, 08:37:45 AM by ziggy »
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Offline WayOutWest

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #24 on: March 25, 2008, 01:25:33 AM »
Posted this a while back.  Teams just fell asleep at the switch.

Ten teams that had the goods to get Gasol
By Chad Ford
ESPN.com
Updated: February 5, 2008

"Merry Christmas, L.A."

That sentiment, voiced by Dallas Mavericks coach Avery Johnson upon hearing about the Pau Gasol trade, has been resonating around the NBA.

While just about everyone expected the Memphis Grizzlies to trade Gasol before the Feb. 21 trade deadline, no one predicted it would be this soon or for so little in return. Instead of established players, the Los Angeles Lakers gave the Grizzlies only a package of expiring contracts, draft picks and marginal prospects for Gasol.

While most GMs weren't publicly venting their frustration on having missed out on Gasol, plenty were willing to do so privately.

The excuses ranged from blaming Grizzlies GM Chris Wallace to blaming their owners to ? well ? pointing the finger in just about every direction but their own.

One GM I spoke to asserted he had a better deal to offer, claiming that Wallace didn't return his calls.

Another said that just two weeks ago, Wallace was asking for twice as much in return. If this GM had known the Grizzlies were lowering the asking price on Gasol, he would've made another offer, he said.

A Western Conference GM said the Grizzlies' timing threw him off: "Big trades like this normally don't happen until after the All-Star break. Who would've guessed that the Grizzlies would've jumped the gun and taken such a lopsided deal three weeks before the trade deadline?"

Another prominent GM said his owner vetoed any trade that would've pushed his team into luxury-tax territory.

Sour grapes, anyone?

From the sob stories, two themes emerged:

One, a lot of GMs are more than a little jealous that the Lakers, of all teams, landed Gasol -- especially given the price tag.

Second, it sounds like the Grizzlies didn't walk away with the best deal available.

Given that, we have to ask: Which other teams could have landed Gasol, and what could they have offered?

As a starting point, let's look at the basic parameters of the deal the Grizzlies accepted:

? About $11 million in expiring contracts (Kwame Brown and Aaron McKie)
? A prospect drafted in the middle of the first round in 2007 (Javaris Crittenton)
? A second-round pick from the same draft (Marc Gasol)
? Two first-round picks, likely to be in the No. 20 to 30 range (2008 and 2010)

Which teams could have matched or exceeded that deal? As it turns out, plenty of teams could have.

Here's a look at 10 teams that missed the boat on Gasol (in alphabetical order):



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Atlanta Hawks



Potential offer:
? Josh Childress (3.6 million expiring contract)
? Tyronn Lue ($3.5 million expiring contract)
? Lorenzen Wright ($3.25 million expiring contract)
? Anthony Johnson ($2.8 million expiring contract)
? First-round draft pick (2010)
? Note: Shelden Williams or perhaps Marvin Williams could have been included in place of Childress

Why the deal would have worked for Atlanta: Childress is an important sixth man for the team, but the Hawks are stacked with swingmen and probably don't want to pay Childress a lot as a restricted free agent this summer. The rest of the contracts are dead weight.

Gasol would have given the Hawks a much-needed veteran plus flexibility to trade more assets down the road.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: The Grizzlies would have received roughly the same amount of cap space. Childress, who has a 17.8 PER (player efficiency rating) this season, is a better player than Crittenton is likely to become, and the Hawks' draft pick (potentially a lottery pick) likely would be worth more than the two picks the Grizzlies received from the Lakers.

The downside is that Childress is a restricted free agent this summer, and the Grizzlies might have had to shell out more than the midlevel exception to keep him.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chicago Bulls


Potential offer:
? P.J. Brown ($8 million, prorated, expiring sign-and-trade contract)
? Viktor Khryapa ($1.9 million expiring contract)
? Tyrus Thomas ($3.5 million)
? First-round draft pick -- lottery-protected (2008)

Why the deal would have worked for Chicago: While giving up Thomas and a draft pick might have hurt the Bulls' effort to rebuild with youth, they would have been giving up little in terms of actual on-court contribution while adding what they desperately need -- a low-post scoring presence.

The downside for Chicago would have been that adding Gasol's salary to the books would have pushed them into the luxury tax, something Bulls owner Jerry Reinsdorf is telling general manager John Paxson he won't pay.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: The Grizzlies would have received roughly the same amount of cap space.

Thomas has amazing raw tools and would fit a need for the Grizzlies at the 4. He was regarded by many as the top prospect in the 2006 draft, putting him on a much higher plane than Crittenton.

Also, the pick from the Bulls likely would have been in the No. 15-19 range, assuming the Bulls would make the playoffs with Gasol aboard, making it an upgrade over the picks the Lakers sent to Memphis.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Golden State Warriors


Potential offer:
? Mickael Pietrus ($3.4 million expiring contract)
? Matt Barnes ($3 million expiring contract)
? Austin Croshere ($770,610 expiring contract)
? Patrick O'Bryant ($2.2 million expiring contract)
? Brandan Wright ($2.3 million)
? Kelenna Azubuike ($687,000 expiring contract)
? First-round draft pick

Why the deal would have worked for Golden State: The Warriors would not have given up any of their core players while adding the perfect low-post complement to Don Nelson's run-and-gun system.

O'Bryant is clearly not a Nellie favorite, and Wright is hardly seeing any action either. Given that, getting Gasol would have been quite a coup.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: The Grizzlies would have received roughly the same amount of cap space.

Wright, a talented 20-year-old big man, was considered one of the best long-term prospects in last year's draft and could fit right into the hole left by Gasol at power forward.

Azubuike and Pietrus have talent, and O'Bryant was a top prospect in 2006. The Grizzlies would have had the option of bringing them back or letting them walk (as expiring contracts).

One note: Azubuike, Barnes and Pietrus would have had to agree to this trade.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Los Angeles Clippers


Potential offer:
? Elton Brand ($15.3 million)
? First-round draft pick (2008)


Why the deal would have worked for the Clippers: There's a chance Brand will bolt this summer when he has a chance to opt out of his deal.

Adding Gasol would've given the Clippers a solid, younger front line while preserving their flexibility to make other deals. And as a bonus, they would have kept Gasol out of the hands of the Lakers.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: Brand is a useful commodity in any scenario, and his contract could have provided the Grizzlies with several appealing options.

If he had decided to return next season, he would have upgraded the team, since he's a better player than Gasol and a better fit on the Grizzlies' front line.

If he had wanted to become a free agent, the Grizzlies could have let him walk (and cleared cap space) or worked out a sign-and-trade with him and another team.

Or he and the Grizzlies could have agreed on a long-term deal to keep him in Memphis.

Also, the Clippers' 2008 first-round pick almost certainly will be a lottery pick of more value than the two picks the Lakers gave the Grizzlies.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Miami Heat


Potential offer:
? Jason Williams ($8.9 million expiring contract)
? Alonzo Mourning ($2.7 million expiring contract)
? Daequan Cook ($1.1 million)
? Alexander Johnson ($770,610)
? Two first-round draft picks

Why the deal would have worked for Miami: If the Heat are going to make one last push for the playoffs with Shaquille O'Neal (who has two more years on his contract after this season, at $20 million per year), they need more help for Dwyane Wade.

Getting Gasol would have given them another scorer and some depth in the frontcourt.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: This trade would have probably been a wash with the Lakers deal.

The Grizzlies would have cleared a similar amount of cap room, and Cook is on par with Crittenton as a prospect.

The two future first-round draft picks might have turned out to be more valuable than the Lakers' picks, especially in the long run. But Miami already owes a pick to Minnesota, so it would have been awhile before the Grizzlies actually received the picks, which might have been a problem.

One solution that might have made a trade with Miami work for Memphis would have been to include Brian Cardinal, whom the Grizzlies have been trying to move for years. The Heat could have sent back Smush Parker and Dorell Wright's expiring contract.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

New Jersey Nets


Potential offer:
? Jamaal Magloire ($4 million expiring contract)
? Bostjan Nachbar ($2.5 million expiring contract)
? Antoine Wright ($1.6 million expiring contract)
? Nenad Krstic ($1.9 million expiring contract)
? Darrell Armstrong ($770,610 expiring contract)
? Malik Allen ($770,610 expiring contract)
? Two first-round draft picks

Why the deal would have worked for New Jersey: The Nets might prefer to move Jason Kidd and/or Vince Carter and start rebuilding. But both players are proving difficult to move.

The other direction to go would be to add a low-post scoring presence. Gasol would have been a great fit. The Nets' payroll would have been totally wrapped up in four guys (Kidd, Carter, Gasol, Richard Jefferson), but the team would have become strong again.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: The deal would have cleared about the same amount of cap room.

Krstic should be a very nice player again once he recovers from knee surgery. He will be a restricted free agent this summer, but the Grizzlies could have locked him up fairly inexpensively.

And the two first-round picks should be better than those the Lakers gave up.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Orlando Magic


Potential offer:
? Keyon Dooling ($3.6 million expiring contract)
? Pat Garrity ($3.8 million expiring contract)
? Maurice Evans ($1.7 million expiring contract)
? J.J. Redick ($2 million)
? Draft rights to Fran Vazquez
? Two first-round draft picks

Why the deal would have worked for Orlando: The Magic are an up-and-coming team, but they lack depth on the front line. Rashard Lewis is playing out of position at the 4. Put Gasol at power forward and move Lewis back to the 3 -- with Turkoglu providing All-Star level support at both positions -- and the Magic would have had perhaps the best front line in the NBA, considering Dwight Howard's presence at center.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: The Grizzlies would have received roughly the same amount of cap space.

Redick is a former lottery pick who can really shoot -- perhaps he's not a better prospect than Crittenton, but he's probably on the same tier. Vazquez is a better international prospect than Marc Gasol.

And those two first-round picks are likely to be better than the picks Memphis got from the Lakers.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Phoenix Suns


Potential offer:
? Shawn Marion ($16.4 million, can opt out after season)
? Atlanta's 2008 first-round draft pick

Why the deal would have worked for Phoenix: The Suns are looking for size and have been shopping Marion for two years. Meanwhile, he asked to be traded during training camp and might opt out of his contract, leaving Phoenix empty-handed.

The Suns actually would have saved some money in the short term and wouldn't have had to worry anymore about Marion's moods or negotiating position. While Gasol wouldn't have given them the toughness they need, he would have been a great fit in coach Mike D'Antoni's system.

As for the draft pick, the Suns don't seem to value those, usually selling them or trading them away.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: The Grizzlies would have cleared a great amount of cap room if Marion opted out of his contract, which would have been expected, given the choice of staying in Memphis or leaving for a long-term contract elsewhere. Also, that could have led to a sign-and-trade opportunity for Memphis to land a player it might have wanted this summer.

If Marion had decided not to opt out, his contract would still be expiring in 2009.

Atlanta's draft pick likely will be a late-lottery or mid-first-round pick, which is probably more valuable than the pair of picks the Lakers gave up.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


San Antonio Spurs


Potential offer:
? Brent Barry ($5.5 million expiring contract)
? Francisco Elson ($3 million expiring contract )
? Robert Horry ($3.6 million expiring contract)
? Ian Mahinmi ($625,000)
? Two first-round draft picks (2008 and 2010)

Why the deal would have worked for San Antonio: Adding Gasol would've injected new life into the franchise. With Gasol and Tim Duncan manning the frontline and Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili in the backcourt, the Spurs would've been back on top of the West. The downside would be the serious luxury tax ramifications of adding Gasol. But he'd probably be worth it.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: This is virtually an identical deal to what the Lakers offered Memphis. The Grizzlies would have received roughly the same amount of cap space.

Mahinmi is a prospect, albeit a very raw one, who can play the 4.

The two first-round picks, like the Lakers, would've likely been very late first-round picks.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Toronto Raptors


Potential offer:
? Andrea Bargnani ($4.8 million)
? Carlos Delfino ($1.8 million expiring contract)
? Juan Dixon ($2.5 million expiring contract)
? Joey Graham ($1.6 million)
? Jamario Moon ($770,610)

Why the deal would have worked for Toronto: The franchise is high on Bargnani and Moon, but Gasol alongside Chris Bosh would have given the Raptors one of the best front lines in basketball. Given the strength throughout the roster, the Raptors would have been real competitors to the Celtics and the Pistons.

Why the deal would have worked for Memphis: The Grizzlies would not have cleared a lot of cap room, but they would have received some very interesting young players, especially Bargnani (the No. 1 pick in the 2006 draft) and Moon, an older rookie who is likely to be a first team All-Rookie selection this year.


Chad Ford covers the NBA for ESPN Insider.

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Offline Randy

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #25 on: March 25, 2008, 08:34:31 AM »
Here is a little info on Gasol -- definately sounds like a worthless piece of trash who can't do anything, huh, ziggy?

Quote
February 19, 2008
The current leader in efficiency rating in the ACB League, Marc Gasol has built a pretty mistake-free style of game that helps him to emerge as a statistical standout. He?s long, very strong, nicely skilled, and very smart playing the game. A menace in the low post, he shows solid footwork, a decent jump-hook and a very nice turnaround jumper. Indeed his shooting range extends out to the three-point line, while he greatly combines his scoring power with his passing game, not really looking for definitive passes, but feeding his team?s offensive flow by distributing the ball from both the high and low post.

In spite of all that, his nice effort in the quarterfinal game wasn't enough for Akasvayu Girona to overcome an extremely solid Real Madrid team. Despite being regularly double-teamed, Gasol managed to amass 19 points, most of them coming off continuations towards the basket, and other off-ball stuff near the rim. The attention he delivered from Real Madrid defense didn't allow him to produce much in one-on-one plays in the low post, but he still connected on two thunderous one-handed dunks from there, one of them after capturing the baseline with an excellent spin move where he showed nice footspeed.

However, Gasol's great statistical production doesn't always necessarily reflect a dominating performance on the floor. Indeed, it didn't in this Copa. He wasn't really a go-to guy for Girona on the offensive end (mainly because of Real Madrid?s double-teaming defense, that's true), but especially he doesn't make a great impact on the defensive end. His limited mobility gets exploited in pick-and-roll situations that the opponents throw at him; he's not a great intimidator, he allows smaller opponents to shoot over him; and given his superb size, he's not the best rebounder around.

Still, Pau's younger brother is one of the most promising centers in Europe, and probably an underrated piece -by the American media- in the recent blockbuster trade that involved both brothers. Anyway, he doesn't seem to fit too well with the current Memphis Grizzlies game style, but he might be a nice asset to work in a trade in the near future.



Offline Randy

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #26 on: March 25, 2008, 08:43:10 AM »
And there have been a couple of 2nd round draft picks that have done fairly well:
  1.  Arenas
  2.  Boozer
  3.  Manu
  4.  Michael Redd
  5.  Rashard Lewis

A few current players who would have perhaps been worth taking in the first round?

Offline ziggy

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #27 on: March 25, 2008, 09:59:39 AM »
Here is a little info on Gasol -- definately sounds like a worthless piece of trash who can't do anything, huh, ziggy?

Quote
February 19, 2008
The current leader in efficiency rating in the ACB League, Marc Gasol has built a pretty mistake-free style of game that helps him to emerge as a statistical standout. He?s long, very strong, nicely skilled, and very smart playing the game. A menace in the low post, he shows solid footwork, a decent jump-hook and a very nice turnaround jumper. Indeed his shooting range extends out to the three-point line, while he greatly combines his scoring power with his passing game, not really looking for definitive passes, but feeding his team?s offensive flow by distributing the ball from both the high and low post.

In spite of all that, his nice effort in the quarterfinal game wasn't enough for Akasvayu Girona to overcome an extremely solid Real Madrid team. Despite being regularly double-teamed, Gasol managed to amass 19 points, most of them coming off continuations towards the basket, and other off-ball stuff near the rim. The attention he delivered from Real Madrid defense didn't allow him to produce much in one-on-one plays in the low post, but he still connected on two thunderous one-handed dunks from there, one of them after capturing the baseline with an excellent spin move where he showed nice footspeed.

However, Gasol's great statistical production doesn't always necessarily reflect a dominating performance on the floor. Indeed, it didn't in this Copa. He wasn't really a go-to guy for Girona on the offensive end (mainly because of Real Madrid?s double-teaming defense, that's true), but especially he doesn't make a great impact on the defensive end. His limited mobility gets exploited in pick-and-roll situations that the opponents throw at him; he's not a great intimidator, he allows smaller opponents to shoot over him; and given his superb size, he's not the best rebounder around.

Still, Pau's younger brother is one of the most promising centers in Europe, and probably an underrated piece -by the American media- in the recent blockbuster trade that involved both brothers. Anyway, he doesn't seem to fit too well with the current Memphis Grizzlies game style, but he might be a nice asset to work in a trade in the near future.




Once again Randy, you make up shyte.  Please show me where I said he was a worthless piece of crap.  COME ON ASSHOLE DO IT.  You were comparing him to Pau, potentially as good, and I said poppycock.
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Offline ziggy

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #28 on: March 25, 2008, 10:00:41 AM »
And there have been a couple of 2nd round draft picks that have done fairly well:
  1.  Arenas
  2.  Boozer
  3.  Manu
  4.  Michael Redd
  5.  Rashard Lewis

A few current players who would have perhaps been worth taking in the first round?

And besides Manu who I already mentioned, how many of them were Euro's?????????????????   ZERO
A third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. A second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. A first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking.

A quotation is a handy thing to have about, saving one the trouble of thinking for oneself.

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Offline Randy

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Re: My grades of the trades....
« Reply #29 on: March 25, 2008, 10:12:53 AM »
Here is a little info on Gasol -- definately sounds like a worthless piece of trash who can't do anything, huh, ziggy?

Quote
February 19, 2008
The current leader in efficiency rating in the ACB League, Marc Gasol has built a pretty mistake-free style of game that helps him to emerge as a statistical standout. He?s long, very strong, nicely skilled, and very smart playing the game. A menace in the low post, he shows solid footwork, a decent jump-hook and a very nice turnaround jumper. Indeed his shooting range extends out to the three-point line, while he greatly combines his scoring power with his passing game, not really looking for definitive passes, but feeding his team?s offensive flow by distributing the ball from both the high and low post.

In spite of all that, his nice effort in the quarterfinal game wasn't enough for Akasvayu Girona to overcome an extremely solid Real Madrid team. Despite being regularly double-teamed, Gasol managed to amass 19 points, most of them coming off continuations towards the basket, and other off-ball stuff near the rim. The attention he delivered from Real Madrid defense didn't allow him to produce much in one-on-one plays in the low post, but he still connected on two thunderous one-handed dunks from there, one of them after capturing the baseline with an excellent spin move where he showed nice footspeed.

However, Gasol's great statistical production doesn't always necessarily reflect a dominating performance on the floor. Indeed, it didn't in this Copa. He wasn't really a go-to guy for Girona on the offensive end (mainly because of Real Madrid?s double-teaming defense, that's true), but especially he doesn't make a great impact on the defensive end. His limited mobility gets exploited in pick-and-roll situations that the opponents throw at him; he's not a great intimidator, he allows smaller opponents to shoot over him; and given his superb size, he's not the best rebounder around.

Still, Pau's younger brother is one of the most promising centers in Europe, and probably an underrated piece -by the American media- in the recent blockbuster trade that involved both brothers. Anyway, he doesn't seem to fit too well with the current Memphis Grizzlies game style, but he might be a nice asset to work in a trade in the near future.




Once again Randy, you make up shyte.  Please show me where I said he was a worthless piece of crap.  COME ON ASSHOLE DO IT.  You were comparing him to Pau, potentially as good, and I said poppycock.

I guess if you can't discuss -- try calling names, huh, zig? 

Quote
HE WAS A SECOND ROUND PICK FOR CHRIST SAKE.  IF HE IS SO DAMN GOOD WHY DID HE SLIP TO THE SECOND ROUND?  WHAT HAS HE DONE IN SPAIN?

Hmm, you certainly don't seem to be extolling much of any kind of real basketball talent.  I'm trying to read how you see much value in him in your statements -- it's kind of tough to come to any kind of conclusion there, zig.

I don't know why you have such a bug up your butt recently -- suddenly every post becomes a personal attack complete with name-calling.  Is that how you want to be treated on this board?  Have you watched any feed for Marc Gasol?  I looked up some games online after the Lakers drafted Gasol -- I saw a lot of potential there -- whether he lives up to it or not, is another.  Obviously, many thought that Bynum would never amount to anything -- at this point, Oden hasn't done anything in this league -- I'm not trying to say that Marc Gasol and Oden have the same potential or the same abilities -- just saying that neither have proven anything and they won't until they actually get on the court.  Until then, it's all conjecture and speculation.  It's some of what I thought this board was all about!