Suns looking good with Shaq so far.

[WayOutWest]

Another double digit loss to a playoff bound team?

15 and 7 is not going to get them a championship.  While I dont think it will happen it would be funny to see them drop to 6-7th in the west come playoff time.

It won't be too funny if Shaq plays inspired ball in the playoffs and knocks a higher seeded team out.

[Reality]

^^ additionally, Diaw 2 pts in 22 minutes in tonights loss to Hornets.

[westkoast]

Another double digit loss to a playoff bound team?

15 and 7 is not going to get them a championship.  While I dont think it will happen it would be funny to see them drop to 6-7th in the west come playoff time.

It won't be too funny if Shaq plays inspired ball in the playoffs and knocks a higher seeded team out.

You are as dellusional as he is.

So what you are saying is he has not played inspired ball against the Lakers, Pistons, and Hornets?  He was just going through the motions in a 30 and 17 point loss?  Cuz to me it looked like he played as inspired as he could against the Lakers yet they still lost and gave up 130 points.  In the D they gave up over 110 points.  Last night they gave up 120.  Their defense is EVEN WORSE now.

WOW you need to come to terms with the fact that his body just can't get it done anymore for the time it would require to "dominate" a game.  He shouldn't be playing more then 20-25 minutes a game.  The only way he is going to have a dominating game is if they center their offense around him.

So far..PHX looks pretty regular.  While I am not saying its all Shaq's fault I am saying messing with what worked did.  I wouldn't attribute their funk to Shaq as much as I would Steve Kerr for trying an experiment mid season.

And for those who said he wouldn't slow down PHX at all...They only got 75 shots off last night.  Something they use to do mid way into the 3rd lol

[Reality]

So what you are saying is he has not played inspired ball against the Lakers, Pistons, and Hornets?  He was just going through the motions in a 30 and 17 point loss?  Cuz to me it looked like he played as inspired as he could against the Lakers yet they still lost and gave up 130 points.  In the D they gave up over 110 points.  Last night they gave up 120.  Their defense is EVEN WORSE now.

And they limited Boston to a season low 77 points.
Playoffs have more rest between games then reg season.
Entire team needs to play D, it's not all on Shaq.
Give Shaq some HGH laced bananas.  He'll be alright.

[WayOutWest]

WOW you need to come to terms with the fact that his body just can't get it done anymore for the time it would require to "dominate" a game. 

Like I posted before, it may come down to just that.  Inspired ball was the wrong term, he has been playing very inspired but he just can't get a rythm with the Suns.  And I have noticed the "non-paint" negative effect on defense with Shaq, he is just not active enough.  I just expected a bit more from the Suns, with the exception of Amare, the Suns have not really responded as positively as I expected.  I still think the Suns best ball is yet to come, I really want to see how the Suns do against the Spurs, the Spurs are the bench mark by which all current playoff teams are judged.  If the Suns can play the Spurs the way they played the Lakers I think they will be in good shape come playoff time.  Yes I know they lost to the Lakers but that came could have gone either way in the final quarter and it was the best regular season game I've seen this year.

[westkoast]

So what you are saying is he has not played inspired ball against the Lakers, Pistons, and Hornets?  He was just going through the motions in a 30 and 17 point loss?  Cuz to me it looked like he played as inspired as he could against the Lakers yet they still lost and gave up 130 points.  In the D they gave up over 110 points.  Last night they gave up 120.  Their defense is EVEN WORSE now.

And they limited Boston to a season low 77 points.
Playoffs have more rest between games then reg season.
Entire team needs to play D, it's not all on Shaq.
Give Shaq some HGH laced bananas.  He'll be alright.

Right...but in 3 games they gave up an insane amount of points. 

3 > 1

They also let teams shoot over 50% for long stretches of time.  Last night in the 3rd the Hornets shot 60% from the field.  They are still a weak rebounding team.  Shaq's 7 boards a game is on clip with what Marion would grab.  Not lucky for me I am in AZ so I got to watch the game, they looked very average and beatable.  Not what I would say is a championship team.

WOW I think the Suns best ball was last year in the second half of the season/playoffs.  They don't look like they will be able to match that.  I don't want to fully blame Shaq as he won't make or break the team with his role.  I blame Steve Kerr for a mid season experiment when the team was already very good.

[Reality]

Right...but in 3 games they gave up an insane amount of points. 

3 > 1

They also let teams shoot over 50% for long stretches of time.  Last night in the 3rd the Hornets shot 60% from the field.  They are still a weak rebounding team.  Shaq's 7 boards a game is on clip with what Marion would grab.

Not lucky for me I am in AZ so I got to watch the game, they looked very average and beatable.  Not what I would say is a championship team.

As with WoW, i agree Shaq and the Suns have been inconsistent and your concerns are valid.  We shall see what transpires.  They will not beat the Spurs in the playoffs.

WoW

Yes I know they lost to the Lakers but that came could have gone either way in the final quarter and it was the best regular season game I've seen this year.

  This kind of progress is heartwarming.

[WayOutWest]

This kind of progress is heartwarming.

Your complete lack of progress is astounding!

[Lurker]

Some interesting stats...last 10 games don't include last night.  Also in the last 10 games that I am using Marion played 1 game and Shaq 4.

First figure is through first 47 games; second is last 10

FGA/game        84.06  83.2
opp FGA/game   90.15  92.4
FTA/game         22.3   25.5
opp FTA/game   22.5   19.6
3pta/game        23.5   19.6
opp 3pta/game  16.6    18.3
pts/game        109.2   110.8
opp pts/game  103.2   109.5
fg%                .492     .499
opp fg%          .450     .471
3pt%              .382     .383
opp  3pt%       .333     .377
steals              7.53    5.00
opp stls           6.91    7.50
turnovers         13.1    14.9
opp turnovers   13.8    12.1

The numbers support what everyone has been saying...offensively Shaq hasn't hurt the Suns scoring wise.  But look closer and you see that fg attenpts and MORE IMPORTANTLY 3 point attempts are down.  The real key though is in the defensive numbers.  Opponents are getting more shots and more 3 point attempts and are making them at a higher percentage than before.  Steals are down and opponent steals are up.  Turnovers are up but opponent turnovers are down.  Suns are having more trouble stopping teams than before and defense wins titles.

[Reality]

^^ True but in fairness to Snaq, 4 of 5 games have been vs Division leaders.
The averages should swing more in he and Phxs favor as Phx gets to play some cupcakes.  Seattle, Memphis again, MN.

The stats you posted may indeed hold up, I'm just sayin.

[WayOutWest]

Opponents are getting more shots and more 3 point attempts and are making them at a higher percentage than before.  Steals are down and opponent steals are up.  Turnovers are up but opponent turnovers are down.  Suns are having more trouble stopping teams than before and defense wins titles.

What do the rebounding numbers say?  What about 2nd chance points and points in the paint?  I don't mind if teams are getting more 3 pointers if the trade off is they are getting fewer offensive rebounds for easy put backs.  That just indicates teams are not having an easy time on the boards and inside and settling for 3 pointers and jumpers.

[Lurker]

Opponents are getting more shots and more 3 point attempts and are making them at a higher percentage than before.  Steals are down and opponent steals are up.  Turnovers are up but opponent turnovers are down.  Suns are having more trouble stopping teams than before and defense wins titles.

What do the rebounding numbers say?  What about 2nd chance points and points in the paint?  I don't mind if teams are getting more 3 pointers if the trade off is they are getting fewer offensive rebounds for easy put backs.  That just indicates teams are not having an easy time on the boards and inside and settling for 3 pointers and jumpers.

Sorry I thought I put rebounding numbers in there.  That is one area where Shaq has really helped but the info I have doesn't break down second chance points.  And overall if your opponents' offensive efficiency rises while yours stays the same you will lose more games.

Offensive rebs     8.3  10.1
opponent          14.4  12.9
Total rebounds   40.6   42.8
opponent          46.6   41.4
Assists              27.4   24.0
opponent          19.8   18.5
Blocks                7.1     6.1
opponents          3.7     4.1

[westkoast]

BTW..Someone up at ESPN is a huge Shaq fan as they fudged up stats about wins and losses since he joined the Suns.

They said they have won 2 games and lost 3 but I could have sworn the only team they've beat is Boston with losses coming from LA, Detroit, and NO.  They also said since trading Marion the Suns have gone 5-5 but from my count it's 5-7 after last nights loss.

Not really that important but I found it funny that it looked like they messed up the numbers in his favor on purpose as it was done two seperate times.

And I would say the rebounding has got a little bit better with Shaq but you also have to consider that the other team is getting a lot more shots so obviously there would be more rebounds to grab.  The perimeter defense is just HORRID now.

I'm sorry but this squad is not going to get past the Spurs.  Duncan is going to abuse Shaq in the post and Parker/Manu are going to have a field day with this perimeter defense now.  Manu especially as he won't have Marion bothering him.

[Reality]

BTW..Someone up at ESPN is a huge Shaq fan as they fudged up stats about wins and losses since he joined the Suns.

They said they have won 2 games and lost 3 but I could have sworn the only team they've beat is Boston with losses coming from LA, Detroit, and NO.  They also said since trading Marion the Suns have gone 5-5 but from my count it's 5-7 after last nights loss.

Not really that important but I found it funny that it looked like they messed up the numbers in his favor on purpose as it was done two seperate times.

Tue, Feb 26 @ Memphis W 127-113

[westkoast]

BTW..Someone up at ESPN is a huge Shaq fan as they fudged up stats about wins and losses since he joined the Suns.

They said they have won 2 games and lost 3 but I could have sworn the only team they've beat is Boston with losses coming from LA, Detroit, and NO.  They also said since trading Marion the Suns have gone 5-5 but from my count it's 5-7 after last nights loss.

Not really that important but I found it funny that it looked like they messed up the numbers in his favor on purpose as it was done two seperate times.

Tue, Feb 26 @ Memphis W 127-113

Ahh my mistake.  I stand corrected.  I don't remember seeing the game on Tuesday's line up.