Kobe forcing a trade. Or not.

[Reality]

My angle here is tickets.  I have an offer to buy Laker season tickets.  My current interest level is less then 1% as they want more then face.  However it begets the question, can and will Kobe force a trade?  If so, how?

With the Clips first nixing Livingston for A.I. and now Eltie Brand going down one could assume the Clips will suck even worse then they have lately.  The 2006 good was completely ecliped by the playoff meltdown IMO.  Kaman appears to be another NBA big man money drainer.  So, back to Kobe, is Buss going to trade the #1 draw in an LA basketball season with nothing else?  I can't see him doing that.  I can't see other teams offering more then 60% value for the Kobester.

Sometimes when stars get traded the result is a better team.  In MLB terms, remember when the Seattle Mariners had Hall of Famers Randy Johnson, Ken Griffey Jr and ARod all in their prime?  Couldn't get into a playoff, let alone win a playoff game.  Traded RJ, then Griffey.  Gave Brett Boone steroids for breakfast, lunch and dinner and won 120 games.  I don't think it happens with the Lakers and post Shaq/Kobe.  Still, does Kobe "force" a trade and if so how?

[westkoast]

Reality you having Laker season tickets....I can't even think of a good analogy for it.  Let's just say the end of the world is near!

Kobe wants to win and the Lakers are not making any moves to start to win more games.  Why would you pay more for season tickets if the Lakers organization doesn't even want to invest more money to make the quality of the product they are selling better?  They just raised ticket prices.  That doesn't include the money you will spend to park, eat, and drink.  If I were you, someone who is not a Laker fan, I wouldn't even entertain the idea unless you were planning on selling tickets to games to myself or WOW

Right now he won't say anything and it will continue that way until the end of the USA Basketball Camp.  He seems to be very happy playing alongside his fellow NBA stars and the fact they have an uphill battle to even qualify seems to be challenging him enough to keep him busy.  We will see when that goes down.  My personal opinion is there are plenty of teams who will take him but nothing any other team can give up to the Lakers that will be anywhere near worth it.  The Jermaine O'Neal trade looks like it is going to be dead in the water in the next 3 weeks.

[WayOutWest]

Right now he won't say anything and it will continue that way until the end of the USA Basketball Camp.

That's pretty much the reason the Kobe drama has died down.  When Team USA basketball is over Kobe will start to make noise.  He can't tank the season so he's going to have to work hard to get traded.  If I were Kobe I would try to lead the league in assists.  You can show the Lakers brass how horrible the Laker supporting cast when they only win 32 games while still playing team ball.  Only someone as brilliant as I could pull this off so I'm not holding my breath on Kobe seeing the light.

[Reality]

westkoast, as mentioned my less then 1% interest in the Lakers season tickets at or near face would put me in the "travel agent" business.  With the large number of Lakerists willing to make the trek to Mecca-Staples i would in turn sell them game seats.  I would also save some games for you and WOW, such as Greg Oden and of course the SuperSpurs.  However i have come across an insider only method for getting single game tics below face.

However even in Lakerdom as regards season ticks, whereas previous years anything at or near face was a steal, i would think the trading of the prophet Kobadiah would mean a  dollar drop in value of seats.

Kobe force trade by assisting and not shooting like vs Phx Gm 7.  Interesting. 

[westkoast]

westkoast, as mentioned my less then 1% interest in the Lakers season tickets at or near face would put me in the "travel agent" business.  With the large number of Lakerists willing to make the trek to Mecca-Staples i would in turn sell them game seats.  I would also save some games for you and WOW, such as Greg Oden and of course the SuperSpurs.  However i have come across an insider only method for getting single game tics below face.

However even in Lakerdom as regards season ticks, whereas previous years anything at or near face was a steal, i would think the trading of the prophet Kobadiah would mean a  dollar drop in value of seats.

Kobe force trade by assisting and not shooting like vs Phx Gm 7.  Interesting. 

It would be worth it $$ wise if

A) The Lakers pulled a decent trade out of their rear end before training camp

or

B) It was against Dallas, SA, PHX, Cavs (always hard to get tickets), Miami, and now Boston.  My GF paid 90 bucks a pop for nose bleeds for us to go see Dallas/Lakers on my birthday last year.  I know a number of other people who paid big money for nose bleeds to see the teams I mentioned minus Boston up until now of course.

For the longest time I was getting tickets at face value even during the Payton/Malone/Shaq/Kobe year through ticket master but only very far in advance and on mid level seats.  The nose bleeds were going quicker then.  All the other times I've been I actually paid face value to season ticket holders I knew who had kids and rarely went.

[Lurker]

Here's the latest gossip from ESPN on the subject...

Bryant: 'The Lakers know exactly where I stand'
 By Chris Sheridan
ESPN.com
Updated: August 20, 2007

LAS VEGAS -- It was a simple yes or no question, and Kobe Bryant could have ended much of the speculation over his future simply by answering it.

"Do you still want the Lakers to trade you?"

As we walked toward the team bus some 40 minutes after Team USA's practice ended Saturday, this was his response:

"I'm not going to answer that question. The Lakers know exactly where I stand, and they've known exactly where I stand since the beginning of the summer."

The Kobe story might have regained some legs, thanks in large part to an on-camera interview Bryant gave to ESPN colleague Rachel Nichols in which he seemed to give an indication that things between him and the Lakers had smoothed over.

Here's a section of that interview:

Nichols: "You said one day you wanted to be traded, you said you wanted to be a 'Laker for life.' There were different phone calls back and forth."

Bryant: "I think a lot of people misinterpreted it. But that's water under the bridge to me, because going forward, we're handling our situation between ourselves, meaning the Lakers organization and myself. If things, if things were to be different, we both would have handled the situation a little differently."

"Water under the bridge," he said to Nichols. So I asked him exactly what he meant by that.

Bryant explained that what had washed under the bridge were the emotions and the frustrations he had been feeling earlier this summer when he first said publicly that he wanted the Lakers to trade him.

When I opined that people were going to hear "water under the bridge" and perceive that he was speaking of his trade request, he shook him head in response, frowning, and said that is why he is so reluctant to speak on the subject, because every time he opens his mouth, people walk away with a misperception.

Of course, that's because Bryant has made it difficult to understand what he wants.

It's been almost three months now since that crazy day in late May when Bryant was all over the board in interviews with Stephen A. Smith, Dan Patrick, Mike Bresnahan of the Los Angeles Times and Vic "The Brick" Jacobs of KLAC radio in Los Angeles, first saying he wanted the Lakers to "do the right thing, just do the right thing, man" and then saying he had always wanted to be a "Laker for life."

And just a few days ago, when Nichols asked Bryant how he was feeling about the Lakers at the moment, he replied with another answer that's open to interpretation: "It's my team. It's the team I play for."

Around the league, most people seem to think it boils down to this: Kobe still wants out, but the Lakers won't trade him -- at least that's the impression being left by Lakers GM Mitch Kupchak, who was unavailable for comment because he is not due back from a European vacation until Friday.

But if Bryant holds out, what choice would the Lakers have?

If Bryant were to stage a holdout (which would be his only leverage) and put his image at a colossal risk, the Lakers could try to wait him out, withhold his salary and hope he changed his mind after missing his paychecks. But would the Lakers honestly believe that would work? They know better than anyone that we're talking about perhaps the most stubborn player in the entire NBA, a guy whose competitive instincts take over any time he is challenged.

Is Bryant all of a sudden going to lose that quality simply because the Lakers tell him they're not going to trade him? I think not.

And I'd further argue that any money Bryant lost through a holdout would be recouped by the 15 percent trade kicker in his contract, assuming he could retain that after forcing a trade. When I spoke to Bryant, I told him a "yes" or "no" answer to the question of whether he still wanted to be traded would clear up a lot of confusion for a lot of people, and he explained again that he does not want to propel his status back into the spotlight and steal the focus from Team USA.

So what we're left with is a somewhat cryptic explanation of the "water under the bridge" quote … and little else to go on as we try to figure out what will happen six weeks from now as the Lakers open training camp.

And despite Kobe saying now that the Lakers know exactly how he feels, what is going to matter much more is how he feels then.

Will Kobe be there when the Lakers report to camp in Hawaii? After looking him in the eye and getting a bit of a fresh mid-August reading of his mood, I'm not so certain he will be.

Chris Sheridan covers the NBA for ESPN Insider. To e-mail Chris, click here.

[WayOutWest]

I don't mind Kobe feeling that way and making those demands, I just wish he handn't made those things public.  Why couldn't he just tell that to Buss and Kupcake face to face and actually HELP his position of getting moved to another team.  There isn't a player in the league that the Lakers could trade for strait up for Kobe that brings everything to the court that he does, not to mention guys that come close are pretty much untradable as well.  The only guys that play both ends of the court like Kobe are KG and TD and they are not going anywhere.  Guys like Bron and Wade bring the offense but not the defense, maybe a guy like Nash could do something with the Laker spares but Nash is good for another couple of years at most.

The Lakers are screwed if they trade Kobe even under the best of circumstances unless some GM loses his mind and trades a couple of stars for Kobe (For Reality: now that Kobe has damaged his trade value with his public statements).

[Reality]

So Chris Sheridan suggests a holdout.  Wow, that would be ugly.  Would the Kobester do it?  Would the Lakers then cave?

The Lakers are screwed if they trade Kobe even under the best of circumstances unless some GM loses his mind and trades a couple of stars for Kobe (For Reality: now that Kobe has damaged his trade value with his public statements). 

  I've already offered Parker, Eva and Barry.  You won't get any better then that.  It's a lot, but I'm convinced Manu can teach Kobe how to play team ball.

[WayOutWest]

I've already offered Parker, Eva and Barry.  You won't get any better then that.  It's a lot, but I'm convinced Manu can teach Kobe how to play team ball.

I don't think a 3rd tier player, a media whore and a washed up dunk champion are worth Kwame Brown let alone Kobe.

Maybe a hag like Dianne Cannon for Eva is a fair trade, a has been for a 15 minute ho is a fair trade IMO.  Or Heidi Flise (sic?) for Eva and Flabs?

[Reality]

We'll see who the Lakers end up getting that is better.
So far your Kobe for TD, Wade or Lebron has elicited gut busting laughter in Texas, FL and Cleveland.  Wait, you're saying even they don't measure up in a one on one trade? 

Now, back to the main point.
Would Kobe hold out?  Would the Lakers in turn cave?  Anyone recall any NBA precedent for this?  I don't think the Lakers have ever had a holdout that went into the season have they?

[WayOutWest]

So far your Kobe for TD, Wade or Lebron has elicited gut busting laughter in Texas, FL and Cleveland.  Wait, you're saying even they don't measure up in a one on one trade? 

Your reading comprehension is as bad as ever.  First two of those guys are not on the same level as another as my post pointed out.  Second I put a couple of players on the same level as Kobe.  Third...nevermind, you probably don't even get the first two.

[Reality]

wayoutwest "Guys like Bron and Wade bring the offense but not the defense,"

Now, back to the main point.
Would Kobe hold out?  Would the Lakers in turn cave?  Anyone recall any NBA precedent for this?  I don't think the Lakers have ever had a holdout that went into the season have they?

[westkoast]

I don't mind Kobe feeling that way and making those demands, I just wish he handn't made those things public.  Why couldn't he just tell that to Buss and Kupcake face to face and actually HELP his position of getting moved to another team.  There isn't a player in the league that the Lakers could trade for strait up for Kobe that brings everything to the court that he does, not to mention guys that come close are pretty much untradable as well.  The only guys that play both ends of the court like Kobe are KG and TD and they are not going anywhere.  Guys like Bron and Wade bring the offense but not the defense, maybe a guy like Nash could do something with the Laker spares but Nash is good for another couple of years at most.

The Lakers are screwed if they trade Kobe even under the best of circumstances unless some GM loses his mind and trades a couple of stars for Kobe (For Reality: now that Kobe has damaged his trade value with his public statements).

While I agree with you he shouldn't have aired it out...

Some things just shouldn't have to be said....and improving this team to get out of the first round is one of those things.

[WayOutWest]

wayoutwest "Guys like Bron and Wade bring the offense but not the defense,"

So far your Kobe for TD, Wade or Lebron has elicited gut busting laughter in Texas, FL and Cleveland.  Wait, you're saying even they don't measure up in a one on one trade? 

Just admit you're wrong already.  Clearly I stated TD and KG play both ends like Kobe, you're the one lumping TD in with Bron and Wade, I don't, TD IMO is in a different class of player.

[WayOutWest]

Would Kobe hold out?  Would the Lakers in turn cave?  Anyone recall any NBA precedent for this?  I don't think the Lakers have ever had a holdout that went into the season have they?[/b]

Danny Ferry did it and the Clippers "caved".  Ferry wasn't an NBA proven commodity but he was clearly a NCAA proven commodity that didn't carry through to the NBA.