Author Topic: If Avery Johnson was to coach the Spurs would they be better? Coach question...  (Read 2664 times)

Offline westkoast

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Okay since we've had a somewhat of a debate about coaching, not just from Reality and basketball but Skander has chimed in about football, I thought I'd pose this question to the crew around here...

If roles were reversed and Pop went to Dallas which puts The General back with the Spurs...would both teams do better or worse?  If Pop were to coach the amount of talent and athletic young guys Dallas has, would they be better/worse/in the same spot?  Same goes for AJ, Reality you seem to think he is holding the Spurs back moreso then anything else, does anyone think that the Spurs would be better under The General?  Say, would they have the Mavs record and win streak right now?  Would the Mavs get over the hump in the playoffs and win a title?  Or would SA actually end up winning the title under Avery?

And lets not take the back to back against the Lakers into mind.  I don't think that really should factor in considering the Mavs caught the team after they spent alot of energy to get a W in SA.  Although this thread idea did come to me last night in the first quarter.   Just because the Lakers beat the Spurs but got pounded by the Mavs does not mean Avery is a better coach or Pop is worthless.

I would like to hear from everyone on this one...Rick, DB, Rolando if you are still lurking, the real lurker Lurker, Reality, Randy, W.O.W, jn, x3 (where you at!!), sp101,  etc
« Last Edit: January 19, 2007, 11:19:10 AM by westkoast »
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Offline Reality

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2006 roles reversed the AJ Spurs own Dallas and Pop 4-1 or 4-2.

This year with the roster so jacked up which i attribute in no small part to Poppycock, not sure Avery could pull it off in San Antone with Dallas superior roster moves. 

Football Bill Bellichek or 400 other coaches with this years Chargers talent vs Martyball New England?
Hahahahahhhha.  Oh that made my day.  Can't wait till Skandery sees this.

Offline westkoast

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2006 roles reversed the AJ Spurs own Dallas and Pop 4-1 or 4-2.

This year with the roster so jacked up which i attribute in no small part to Poppycock, not sure Avery could pull it off in San Antone with Dallas superior roster moves. 

Football Bill Bellichek or 400 other coaches with this years Chargers talent vs Martyball New England?
Hahahahahhhha.  Oh that made my day.  Can't wait till Skandery sees this.

So you are saying that it is not Pop's fault as much as it is older legs and a lack of athletic ability?  WOWZER!  That is not what you've been saying ol chap.

And I was speaking more specifically about basketball then I was football.  I already know where Skander stands when it comes to switching out Marty Loosinheimer.
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Offline Reality

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2006 roles reversed the AJ Spurs own Dallas and Pop 4-1 or 4-2.

This year with the roster so jacked up which i attribute in no small part to Poppycock, not sure Avery could pull it off in San Antone with Dallas superior roster moves. 

Football Bill Bellichek or 400 other coaches with this years Chargers talent vs Martyball New England?
Hahahahahhhha.  Oh that made my day.  Can't wait till Skandery sees this.

So you are saying that it is not Pop's fault as much as it is older legs and a lack of athletic ability?  WOWZER!  That is not what you've been saying ol chap.

Well i assumed, and tell me if incorrectly so, that you are speaking of a swap right here and now.  Now, if you are telling me AJ can take over the Spurs in June of 2006 including influence off season roster moves immediately after the Dallas finals, then yes, AJs SA will beat Pop Dallas 2007-8.

Offline westkoast

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2006 roles reversed the AJ Spurs own Dallas and Pop 4-1 or 4-2.

This year with the roster so jacked up which i attribute in no small part to Poppycock, not sure Avery could pull it off in San Antone with Dallas superior roster moves. 

Football Bill Bellichek or 400 other coaches with this years Chargers talent vs Martyball New England?
Hahahahahhhha.  Oh that made my day.  Can't wait till Skandery sees this.

I am saying, at the start of the season, if they were to have their roles reversed, what does everyone think the outcome would be.
So you are saying that it is not Pop's fault as much as it is older legs and a lack of athletic ability?  WOWZER!  That is not what you've been saying ol chap.

Well i assumed, and tell me if incorrectly so, that you are speaking of a swap right here and now.  Now, if you are telling me AJ can take over the Spurs in June of 2006 including influence off season roster moves immediately after the Dallas finals, then yes, AJs SA will beat Pop Dallas 2007-8.
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Offline msc

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This one's easy, as of today it would look exactly like this: 

Spurs - 33-8

Mavs - 27-13

Offline WayOutWest

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IMO Dallas would benefit more.  What AJ brought to Dallas was attention to defense.  While they are no Pistons or Spurs they are much better than in years past with less talent, maybe not less talent but less scoring talent with better overall talent.  The Spurs don't need the defensive mindset that AJ brought to the Mavs, while he may be better at motivating he wouldn't make any significant changes.

The Mavs on the other hand would benefit from a more rigid coach, all too many times I see the Mavs get away from the game plant in put their fate in the wrong person's hands.  Pop's defensive mentality would benefit the Mavs alot more.

While the early record may put the Spurs ahead of the Mavs, in the end the Mavs would win it all.  The Mavs will probably win it all anyway so the point is pretty moot.  I also don't think Riley could abuse Pop as easily as he did AJ last year in the finals.
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Offline Rolando Blackman

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Pop has already won it all
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2007, 02:30:48 PM »
IMHO, even the 'Little General' could not do much to improve the Spurs' formula - with TD being the dominant player in the league now, the game plan for SA is/should be a simple one - pound it in to Tim (Unstoppable Juggernaut) Duncan every time...who can deny him?!

ANSWER:  No one, not even the Daddy.

Dallas, on the other hand cannot always depend on Dirk's 30/10 (that boy done good this year, BTW) to carry them to 'victory' every night - his supporting cast (at this point) is too inconsistent. Given these factors, Pop's mentoring approach would not work with the Mavs at all.  All things considered, I think that Gnarls Barkley would make a great coach for the Spurs - just think if he could wring the same performance from a team that he did from his own overweight, overstressed form!  Of course, he probably could not afford the salary cut from his TNT gig...LOL
   
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Offline westkoast

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IMO Dallas would benefit more.  What AJ brought to Dallas was attention to defense.  While they are no Pistons or Spurs they are much better than in years past with less talent, maybe not less talent but less scoring talent with better overall talent.  The Spurs don't need the defensive mindset that AJ brought to the Mavs, while he may be better at motivating he wouldn't make any significant changes.

The Mavs on the other hand would benefit from a more rigid coach, all too many times I see the Mavs get away from the game plant in put their fate in the wrong person's hands.  Pop's defensive mentality would benefit the Mavs alot more.

While the early record may put the Spurs ahead of the Mavs, in the end the Mavs would win it all.  The Mavs will probably win it all anyway so the point is pretty moot.  I also don't think Riley could abuse Pop as easily as he did AJ last year in the finals.

My thoughts exactly.  AJ brought a more defensive mind and game plan to this team....something he learned from Pop second hand.  I wonder just how good of a defensive team that squad would be if he was there.  The offense is going to be there with Dirk, Terry, and Howard regardless.  The getting over the hump and the consistancy is going to come from defense.
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Offline rickortreat

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I think Avery is the better coach, as Pop would never allow the Mavs offense to be so productive.

IMO, Avery would get a bit more out of the Spurs, because he would be more open to trying different things to get their offense going. 

But if there was a switch now, Dallas would still be better than the Spurs because of their scoring.  Most nights the Spurs can't stay with them, and on the others the Mavs can play a little defense.  The teams are so set in their ways a coach switch wouldn't matter.

Offline Skandery

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Quote
I would like to hear from everyone on this one...Rick, DB, Rolando if you are still lurking, the real lurker Lurker, Reality, Randy, W.O.W, jn, x3 (where you at!!), sp101,  etc

I guess etc. will chime in.   8)


Gregg Popovich (and I've ALWAYS thought this) is spiritually, emotionally, and mentally (in the basketball sense) tied to Tim Duncan.  I think around Tim Duncan, a dominant offensive AND defensive player, Pop knows how to get other things to fit in around that.  Duncan is a low-post presence, so Pop can take journeyman Bowen and turn him into a three point threat simply by the double teams Duncan draws.  Defensively you have perhaps one of the most well-rounded players that has stepped on the court as your anchor.  I've never given Popovich FULL props simply because of the sheer dominance of Duncan and Popovich has never done well without Duncan on the floor.  Now I admit that I've swayed a little in that, Popovich has impressed me with the development of Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili.  We'll, of course, see whether I eat crow when Duncan retires but I just don't see Pop being as comfortable coaching the Dallas team as he is with San An.  Even though Nowitzki probably is a more dynamic offensive player than Duncan and even though top to bottom, Dallas has more depth and talent than San Antonio.  Depending on whether or not Pop meshes well with Terry and especially Howard, I see Dallas being a top 4 seed with a real shot at the Finals at best and a 6th, 7th seed first round ouster at worst.  Overall a little worst.

Avery Johnson will do well in San Antonio since he acquires a defensively stable team, no need to rip his hair out telling Nowitzki why wandering to the perimeter defensively is not condusive to stopping penetration in the lane.  On the other side of the ball, Avery will do well with the likes of Udrih, Finley, and Bowen.  You wonder how Duncan takes the shock to the system of a new coach but you'd think Parker and Ginobili would welcome at least a willingness to open the game a little during stretches.  Avery could become to happy with this and in the process shift the focus away from Duncan, in which case San Antonio begins to do worst.  As long as he keeps Duncan at the forefront and utilizes the deep (albeit aging) roster of San Antonio to exploit mismatches and keep guys fresh, he should do well.  At best, one of the top 2 seeds and a championship contendor.  At worst, a 5th, 6th seed no one wants to play.  Overall no change.

Despite all that, I think it would be an egregious mistake for both teams to switch guys even though I don't think either team will change all that much with the change.  Popovich knows the ins and outs of almost every player in San Antonio and has become a master of staying competitive during the season while keeping an aging roster fresh for a long playoff run.  Avery Johnson is probably used to the young, youthful thoroughbreds that can run all day in Dallas (Howard, Harris, Daniels (previously), Ager) and might overuse the likes of Horry, Finley, Barry, Duncan, etc.             
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Offline westkoast

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I would like to hear from everyone on this one...Rick, DB, Rolando if you are still lurking, the real lurker Lurker, Reality, Randy, W.O.W, jn, x3 (where you at!!), sp101,  etc

I guess etc. will chime in.   8)



           

BLEH!!!  You swear I wanted to exclude anyone in the discussion, in fact I name checked you!!   :D

And I left out Mr. Taco's aka JoMaL even tho I was talking to him literally 2 minutes before I made the thread if it makes you feel better
« Last Edit: January 19, 2007, 06:10:13 PM by westkoast »
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